Rate Muffler Sound

[eben]

I have an 02 C4S and am trying to decide on a muffler upgrade for better sound than stock.

I have only heard PSE and stock. Anyone have experience with the other offerings out there? I realize that HP gain would be marginal if any. I am looking for more throaty powerful sound, but not punk noisy. Also no annoyance when hiway cruising.

Could someone please rate the following in relative loudness order: Stock GHL Schenell Dansk BB Fabspeed PSE others?

Thanks

Eric

[eben]

After posting this question, I found a thread that started with Fabspeeds and ended up talking about most of the makes I asked about.

I think I am leaning toward the GHLs. Any other input appreciated.

Eric

[Izzy]

I have installed Fabspeed and Ghylls both. I have a Cabrio, and found the Fabspeed too loud for my taste, the resonance was . Tried re-installing a few times until giving up.

Now have Ghylls, and they are less loud. What I can tell, is the Fabs where pretty much louder on all bands. The GHL's seem to be a bit louder to 3500 RPM, from then upwards have the same "snarl" as the Fabspeed. For my use, not too loud on the normal city driving, but get the effect on the track at higher RPM's.

Many have the Fabspeeds here and it is perfect for them. On a coupe, you may not find them too loud. If you end up buying these, try looking up Fabspeed dealers, they can give you better prices than buying direct.

The main thing is the effect of having the higher performance mufflers. I hung stocks, Fabspeeds, and GHL's a few times (on-off) during the same weekend. It was a very noticeable difference in the throttle response with the high performance mufflers. The stocks felt "constricted", which sounds crazy for a 911. But it was interesting to compare the noise level, vibration level, and throttle response back to back on the same car. All subjective measurements, I know.

But you will enjoy high perfomance mufflers on this car.

Izzy

[eben]

Thanks for the info Izzy, from your description, it sounds like what I want is the GHLs. My wife is already moaning that I am thinking about changing the sound because she likes it the way it is. I found some GHLs quoted at $795 ( W/O tips ) from RER in Phoenix. I read somewhere that someone refered to 'regular' GHLs, I have only found one type for 996's , are there others? The other name out there is Schnell from Germany, I wonder if anyone has heard them?

Eric

[Izzy]

Eric,

Got regular GHL's on mine. Bought them used from a member here. Look in Ebay too, just in case. I got the Schnell cold air intake too. I have seen their mufflers also in Ebay, hard to tell from a picture the quality of build. Forget the sound. From the picture, looked like a lot of carburation was visible near the weld lines, not a good sign. Can lead to problems later on if they did not passivate the welds. Fabspeeds seem well made.

You can probably listen to the PSE's at the dealer, they may have a car with them on already.

One fun fact with either Fabspeed or GHL, if you rev the engine in a multilevel garage, you can hear the chirping of a few car alarms getting the vibes.

[911turboz]

I've had both on my 996's - GHL and Fabspeed. GHL has nice note at RPM's and no resonance. Fabspeed has more aggressive sound at idle and at RPM. Not a substantial performance difference noticed in the driver's seat between the two

Regards

sb

[eben]

Ok thanks for the comments, I'm ordering some GHLs tomorrow. Maybe I can get them on before the annual PCA escape WE event on May 13.

Eric

[Brian D. Barrett]

I have a 99, 996 C-2 and when purchased commented on the sound of the throaty, growl from the exhaust and asked which aftermarket system had been installed?

Seems that when the dealer installed the lowering kit and aerokit in their shop they removed the stock mufflers, cut them open, removed the internal baffles, welded them back together and reinstalled them on the car! Probably not as pretty as stainless but considering not much change in performance per cost of aftermarket systems if all you want is more growl easy modification! I suppose it also does free up the exhaust flow and I know it is louder cause my wife says it sounds like my Harley.

[Danyol]

http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=7577&hl=

I installed a GHL system (header and exhaust), I'm still very happy.

Edited April 18, 2006 by Danyol

[Guest]

In my opinion and experience with my 996, i belive the only way to go is with the porsche PSE. It costs alittle more, but you get the sound you are after and if you want, very rare that I do. You can turn the system off with a switch that shuts off the roar via the vaccum fromthe engine. It also has an auto cut out at speeds below 45 mph, but i would reccomend not hooking up the cut out. It is nice when you are at afuneral or on the phone to be able to hit the button and mute the pipes. The sound is great and when you down shift or go through a tunnel ot will make the hair stand up on your neck.

The sound is not obnoxius though, just right.

[ruftec]

I believe that the PSE exhaust is causing the problem I am having with the rattling noise.

The problem is the mechanical piece that is rigged to the muffler to regulate the sound.

I was tapping around the area to try to identify this most annoying sound and I think I found it.

I will call the Porsche dealer tomorrow and schedule a visit.

I would recommend the Ruf exhaust. It looks like it weighs much less and I'm sure it sounds great.

If this problem can't be fixed I might switch.

Has anyone here with PSE had this problem? Its like a bunch of loose chains when driving in gear in the

lower rpm range.

[eben]

Certainly are lots of options, from the budget chop the stock units to the $2000+ RUF units. The PSE does sound good but there is no performance incr and they are likely even a bit heavier than stock. (also quite expensive). I am looking at ordering a set of GHLs from a dealer called RERmotorsports in Phoenix. He has quoted $795 plus shipping. I haven't found any used units on ebay so I will likely go this route. The people that responded have said that they like the GHL sound and quality.

Thanks for the input..

Eric

PS anyone dealt with RER?

[eben]

Just came back from the test drive of the new GHL mufflers and its a big ALL RIGHT! Its late so I only tried a couple of foot downs and I like it!! Especially along side a median. Sounds just a bit louder than stock with the windows up and much deeper with them down.

Everything worked OK with RERmotorsports. He was very prompt with replies and no issues. Wouldn't hesitate to deal with again.

Install took me 4 hours ( with dinner break ). I took off the rear bumper ( thanks Izzy ) and side heat shields. This was likely not necessary but I power washed all the pieces while they were off and every thing is like new now. Had to screw around with the tips a lot to get them just right.

The tip bracket mount clamps would not tighten far enough so I replaced them with 2 stainless hose clamps each side.

Weighed new and old on the bathroom scale stock 17lbs ea GHL 9 lbs ea ( scale is likely not that accurate at low weights )

Stock ugly, GHL beautiful. I put one on the coffee table in the living rom when I unpacked them. She wasn't impressed.

Taking the car to work tomorrow, maybe Ill get up a little early and go the long way.

Eric

[juankimalo]

I've only heard the PSE one, and for me it's fantastic

[nycebo]

I have heard some members here and on other boards bemoan the fact that the PSE mufflers can develop a rattle because of the vacuum actuated flap at certain rpms. It is principally used to dull the sound across the loudest revbands AND also to electronically mute the exhaust back to stock sounding with a flick of the switch on the dash. Of course, Renntech already has a post detailing how to disengage it and I think it is a must.

To me, it was a little too much to be asking from a flaming hot muffler. Instead, I opted for the mightily expensive Rufs and while expensive (see four words earlier) they sound so blatantly fantastic that I almost cry every time I drive. Even my girlfriend concurs that the sound both in and behind the car is sublime.

I've heard the Fabs in person and while light and loud, they rumble a little more than snarl and most certainly to hark back to that air-cooled sound (which I miss every day but what can we do?).

GHL Regulars seem a great value and sound quite nice. For the money, that's going to be the best start.

Of course, the best idea is to find a local PCNA chapter and HEAR all the exhausts in person...because aural pleasure is VERY personal. Good luck.

[eben]

So its been about 3 weeks with the GHL mufflers and I really like the sound! I find I don't carry the revs as high as I used to because the sound effects come so much earlier. I really like driving with the windows down and always have the rear of the sun roof up to hear the sound. I am always pumping the throttle to hear the sound ( pisses off wife ). During normal driving and when at full throttle there is no resonance. I do get a weird vibration at times at about 1500 to 1800 RPM with just above idle throttle ( like when cruising in a parking lot ) . The first time I felt this I didn't know what it was. The door panel was vibrating against my arm. Any change in RPM or throttle and the vibration goes away. This is a small issue and doesn't really bother me. I have noticed that sometimes when starting out at a light it gives a real loud snort blat when coming off idle. Then I try to duplicate it and I can't . Haven't got this figured out yet but it really sounds hot when it happens. No problem running silent if you want to, just go easy on the gas. I have limited experience with other muffler sounds but I can say that GHL = GOOD

Eric

[delirium]

Is there any muffler that has sound that does not trail off at the higher RPM's?

[Rthomson]

I have the Fasbspeed exhaust in my 2001 C2 Cab and my wife won't ride in it because the drone is severe in the 2600-3400 rpm range. Everyone has to make choices....

[KevinMac]

I think the key quesion is what aftermarket units do not have resonance. Resonance will cause driver fatigue on long drives and cockpit noise that is not comfortable/

[phillipj]

I guess I must be fortunate because my wife doesn't like to ride in my car at all (with any muffler or at any time) :lol: :lol: .. :lol:

[cbr786]

I guess I must be fortunate because my wife doesn't like to ride in my car at all (with any muffler or at any time) :lol: :lol: .. :lol:

i have fabspeed muffler bypass system sounds like an old land rover v8 utube it and see for your self the comparison lol

I think I will take them off and put some other exaust on as the fabspeed sound is a bit too loud .... and I dont want people comparing the sund to an old land rover ha ha

[BruceP]

Just to contribute to your research... I have the EVOMS mufflers. I find them a bit rough and rowdy sounding off idle (they set off car alarms), very civilized and expensive sounding once you're through 2200rpm or so, and then a fantastic shriek past 4500rpm or so. No resonance in the car at any speed.

[Benjamin Choi]

there is no substitute for oem pse

[996Craig]

Just to contribute to your research... I have the EVOMS mufflers. I find them a bit rough and rowdy sounding off idle (they set off car alarms), very civilized and expensive sounding once you're through 2200rpm or so, and then a fantastic shriek past 4500rpm or so. No resonance in the car at any speed.

Perhaps things have changed since you posted this, but Evoms is now selling Fabspeed mufflers for my 99 C2.