Carrera 4S 996 2nd gear sometimes grinding

[thormann]

Hi,

 

sometimes after shifting to the 2nd gear and releasing the clutch, the gear pops out after a grinding noise. This happens mostly once in cold condition, later there is no issue shifting to the 2nd gear. 

 

I have read about the 2nd gear pop out and the gbox solution. I understand, that here the 2nd gear pops out after a while. In my case, the problem occurs only when shifting to the 2nd gear. Once the gear is in (with clutch released), it never pops out. 

 

Most probably my synchro rings are getting worn?  Now I have read about the Redline no slip oil, which could help at least for a while. Has anyone experience with this in a similar case?

Is it worth a try?

 

For the moment I would prefer to avoid the exchange the synchro rings, if possible.

 

Thanks for any comment or help !!

Edited February 7, 2021 by thormann

[judgejon]

I always used Redline, but never had the issue you are experiencing.  Are you “speed shifting” it?  My issue was missing the shift from 2nd to 3rd when I “speed shifted” which has never been a Porsche thing.  Smooth shift motion, then never an issue.  Not sure if this helps you.  Hope your issue is not the synchro or throw-out bearing. That’s one reason it’s a C4$.... Good luck. 

[JFP in PA]

6 hours ago, thormann said:

Hi,

 

sometimes after shifting to the 2nd gear and releasing the clutch, the gear pops out after a grinding noise. This happens mostly once in cold condition, later there is no issue shifting to the 2nd gear. 

 

I have read about the 2nd gear pop out and the gbox solution. I understand, that here the 2nd gear pops out after a while. In my case, the problem occurs only when shifting to the 2nd gear. Once the gear is in (with clutch released), it never pops out. 

 

Most probably my synchro rings are getting worn?  Now I have read about the Redline no slip oil, which could help at least for a while. Has anyone experience with this in a similar case?

Is it worth a try?

 

For the moment I would prefer to avoid the exchange the synchro rings, if possible.

 

Thanks for any comment or help !!

 

First of all, these transmissions are very sensitive to the lubricant used; over the years, we have had numerous cars come into the shop with everything from noise complaints to poor shifting issues (particularly in the cold), and for the most part everyone was cured by thoroughly draining the lube out of the gearbox and then refilling with the factory fluid.  Most people do not realize that Porsche factory lube, which is a full synthetic, is produced to Porsche specs, and does not conform to aftermarket product specs.  At one time, we inquired of several major lube companies if they had an exact match product, and were uniformly told that, “No, Porsche uses a unique specification lubricant, and the brand market is too small for us to produce a similar product.”

 

That said, even the factory fill cannot correct existing wear issues, or mechanical issues.  Second gear pop out is a well known problem which can often be corrected by installing an updated detent part like the Gbox fix.

[judgejon]

There you go...  “the man” has spoken. 
Cool, Jeff. Right on the money.  I remember that my RedLine was engine oil.  Everything was only oem Porsche.

[thormann]

Thanks both for the replies.

 

I had only read about the Redline NS in combination with my problem. That is why I asked for that. So it would be better to change to the factory fluid? Could that help?

 

I understood, that the common 2nd gear pop out is a bit different from my problem (immediate pop out after releasing the clutch). Could the detent help in my case as well?

 

Thanks again!!!

 

 

[JFP in PA]

The factory fluid is the way to go with these gearboxes.  I would change the fluid and see how the gearbox responds; if you still have the second gear issue, I would be looking at the detent.

[CapeCoral944]

Have you checked your shift cable ends at the transmission? When mine were coming loose shifting to 2nd gear an occasional grind when cold was 1st symptom.

 

[thormann]

OK, Thanks!

 

@CapeCoral944

 

Yes, the cables are O.K. and properly connected!What do you mean with „coming loose“? 

[JFP in PA]

They have a snap on ball connector at the transmission end, which wear with time and become loose:

 

 

[judgejon]

Great pic.  Remember the old 911sc, actually had, I think it was called, “mechanical linkage.”  This was back in the day before e-gas. 
Sucks to get old, my friends. 

Edited February 8, 2021 by judgejon
Better grammar

[JFP in PA]

Perhaps, but then every day you get to make all new friends..........................😱

[Silver_TT]

Yikes be careful.  The previous owner of my 996 TT put redline in the Getrag gearbox (and didn't tell me and removed it from the "complete" service records I got with the car.... shady, shady, shady world of used high end car sales).

 

It trashed some of the synchros and cost a lot to fix.  Passed a PPI and all that before I bought it.........I did my homework, dotted my "i's" crossed my "t's" and still got burned

 

That said I do recommend Stan and GBox out of Boulder, CO, which is the shop that fixed it.  They did an outstanding job and no one knows these gearboxes better than Stan.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Silver_TT

[Silver_TT]

Sorry just saw you're in Germany (my wife is German, from Berlin, I spend several months a year there when it's not COVID).

 

I don't want to alarm you but reading your post closer sounds very similar to what happened with my car (mine did it hot or cold though).  I would try the detent first (if the fluid change doesn't fix it), which is what I did (but in my case neither worked)

 

Here was my bill:

Edited February 8, 2021 by Silver_TT

[JFP in PA]

Running the wrong juice in these gearboxes can get real expensive real quick.........😉

[Silver_TT]

Agree.  But that $4,500 was cheap.  Before some smart person alerted me to the existence of GBox (gee whiz, who could that be) my option from Porsche was a new gearbox 😬

[JFP in PA]

1 hour ago, Silver_TT said:

Agree.  But that $4,500 was cheap.  Before some smart person alerted me to the existence of GBox (gee whiz, who could that be) my option from Porsche was a new gearbox 😬

 

Only proves that even blind squirrel finds and acorn every once in a while........................

[judgejon]

If it’s a Porsche, it’s not cheap to properly maintain.  But regular or early maintaining pays off in the long-run. 
Carrera4$, as we say. 

[Silver_TT]

In my almost 20 years of exposure to the Porsche platform it's my opinion that people inflict more damage on themselves than it is Porsche's fault for being expensive to maintain.  In my case for example, that was a $4500 bill (and that's not counting my indy's bill to take the gearbox out and back in of the car) that never had to happen.  But the person I bought the car from, I learned after buying the car, is a spoiled little brat who doesn't know anything about taking care of his belongings.  He is just one example but many of the things I have read out there on the internet and otherwise about people's advice with respect to taking care of their cars is, frankly, quite shocking.  it doesn't really happen here because the moderators and admins are educated and this is a moderated forum.  But outside of this little bubble we are in here it is rampant to say the very least.

 

Also by way of clarification in case anyone wants to know why the 4th gear and 3/4 shift sleeve are discounted in my bill, this is because Stan had a "used" or otherwise not brand new part that he assured me was in perfect condition and just as good as new else I would have paid for a new one.  I wouldn't trust most people saying that but if you have a 2 minute conversation with Stan, you can see this is a person who is dialed in on these gearboxes to say the very least.  If anyone did end up needing service on their gearbox I would be extremely selective about who I choose to work on it and I definitely would not consider any local shops like transmissions shops.  These gearboxes require specialized knowledge to even open them up safely.

Edited February 9, 2021 by Silver_TT

[thormann]

Thanks for your replies. I will have a look on the ball connectors as well.

 

@Silver_TT

 

Currently I am in Austria, but still too far to go to GBox 😉 I hope that a fluid change or the detent will help...

 

 

[Silver_TT]

I have spent time in Salzburg -- I went to the Christmas markets there the Christmas before last with my wife and kids.  My wife has family outside of Munich on the Chiemsee so I rent a car and drive to places like Austria because it is so close.  Pretty cool how that Christmas market is in a shopping area just built into the side of a rock mountain.

 

I hope the fluid change will fix it for you.  Definitely try that first for sure.  If this is only happening when it's cold, and never when hot, then it may be the fluid.  Generally bad synchros would be bad no matter what the weather.  The detent is cheap and easy to install.  If you end up needing a gearbox repair let me know and I can ask my wife to ask her family.  Her cousin has a 911 TT and GT3 and is an engineer so he might have some idea, he obviously likes the cars.  Given where you are I'm sure there is someone qualified to work on that gearbox if necessary but you want to do your homework first and be sure they are legit and can handle it.  Things can really go south if you don't get someone who knows 100% they are doing on this job.

 

Please keep us posted and my best wishes to you

 

 

 

[thormann]

@Silver_TT

 

Thanks you very much for your support

 

Yes, Salzburg ist a very nice, tiny village, especially around the Christmas time (with no Corona). I live close to Vienna, but have been in Salzburg  a couple of times.

 

Her cousin has both a TT and GT3? Very nice...😀

 

I will try the fluid and the detent and hope very much this will the job. However, I currently have the first factory fill in the transmission (car has about 76.000km only), so this must be the Porsche stuff.

 

I keep you informed.

 

Have a good day 

Edited February 10, 2021 by thormann