Guldenberg IMS anyone?

[Citgot]

Here in Europe LN Engineering’s products are really pricey to say the least. Not many consider the IMS solution as it is considered way overpriced compared to other ordinary bearings. But now I stumbled upon this product in a dutch website that looks like another permanent IMS fix.

 

Has anyone heard about it? Any thoughts?

 

I don’t want to be a test pilot for important engine parts but this is at half the price to IMS Solution. Sounds strange that it isn’t more well known if it offers the same fix at a lower cost.

http://shop.guldenbergracing.nl/996/ims-lager/guldenberg-hydrostatic-ims-bearing

[JFP in PA]

44 minutes ago, Citgot said:

 

Here in Europe LN Engineering’s products are really pricey to say the least. Not many consider the IMS solution as it is considered way overpriced compared to other ordinary bearings. But now I stumbled upon this product in a dutch website that looks like another permanent IMS fix.

 

Has anyone heard about it? Any thoughts?

 

I don’t want to be a test pilot for important engine parts but this is at half the price to IMS Solution. Sounds strange that it isn’t more well known if it offers the same fix at a lower cost.

http://shop.guldenbergracing.nl/996/ims-lager/guldenberg-hydrostatic-ims-bearing

 

Interesting, that product is a direct rip off of the LN IMS Solution, which is patented to Jake Raby. Stand by for this to be shut down in a lawsuit...…..

 

[Citgot]

Well, only if Raby has patent in the EU. Maybe he has, but can’t find any info about it.

[JFP in PA]

1 hour ago, Citgot said:

Well, only if Raby has patent in the EU. Maybe he has, but can’t find any info about it.

 

According to a patent search, they applied for world wide coverage in 2013 and 2016: IMS Solution Patent coverage

[JFP in PA]

And I just heard from Jake, he is aware of it and has taken steps to limit the sale of it.

[Citgot]

Ok, I searched the dutch patent Office as well as the European Patent Office and couldn’t find any patents at all for Raby or IMS Solution. So I guess limit the sales means that it won’t reach the US?

[YellowJacketGS]

Maybe under FLAT 6 INNOVATIONS?

[Citgot]

Tried that as well, no hits. Would be great to know if there is an infingement or not with this product. Don’t want to support any illegal copies.

[JFP in PA]

3 hours ago, Citgot said:

Tried that as well, no hits. Would be great to know if there is an infingement or not with this product. Don’t want to support any illegal copies.

 

Jake did say that it is a rip off copy of his patented product.

[Citgot]

I understand that. However, if it is only patented in the US it can be copied and sold anywhere but in the US. That’s the reality of patents.

 

This thread was meant to find out if anyone had any experience with the Guldenberg IMS product. I guess no one had, so my question is somewhat answered.

 

But the question regarding the legality of Guldenberg or any future similar products is still unanswered. It may not be in Raby’s interest to clear things out as it must be hard seeing your work blatantly copied and he needs to protect his own interests.

 

But for all of the 996/Boxster owners that need an IMS-bearing other solutions are welcome, especially if they can compete in pricing. Then it is up to everyone to decide if you want to pay more to support the inventors or not.

 

As long as a product is not illegal, i mean it is a choice not to patent a product in every country (most likely a very expensive choice), it is a real world option for Porsche owners and at least I will consider it.

 

So if anyone could shine some light on the legal situation it would be welcome.

 

Edit: I asked the manufacturer of Guldenberg who said it is a legal product. IMS solution is patented only in the US.

 

So I have answered my questions. Maybe someone else will find the info interesting or useful.

[JFP in PA]

2 hours ago, Citgot said:

I understand that. However, if it is only patented in the US it can be copied and sold anywhere but in the US. That’s the reality of patents.

 

This thread was meant to find out if anyone had any experience with the Guldenberg IMS product. I guess no one had, so my question is somewhat answered.

 

But the question regarding the legality of Guldenberg or any future similar products is still unanswered. It may not be in Raby’s interest to clear things out as it must be hard seeing your work blatantly copied and he needs to protect his own interests.

 

But for all of the 996/Boxster owners that need an IMS-bearing other solutions are welcome, especially if they can compete in pricing. Then it is up to everyone to decide if you want to pay more to support the inventors or not.

 

As long as a product is not illegal, i mean it is a choice not to patent a product in every country (most likely a very expensive choice), it is a real world option for Porsche owners and at least I will consider it.

 

So if anyone could shine some light on the legal situation it would be welcome.

 

Edit: I asked the manufacturer of Guldenberg who said it is a legal product. IMS solution is patented only in the US.

 

So I have answered my questions. Maybe someone else will find the info interesting or useful.

 

And here is what we do not know:

 

1. The fit and finish of the system components; the LN units are works of art, everything fits together perfectly, all component's are included (I noticed a lack of a spin on filter adaptor set up to connect the oil feed line to with the Guldenberg kit). 
2. The LN units have been tested under some of the most adverse conditions and did not fail.  During development, test engine's were run until failure (spun rod bearings, dropped valves, etc.) to test the system, including running the Solution without and oil feed, with no adverse affect of the Solution.  If fact, IMS Solutions units were actually extracted from failed engine's and reinstalled in other test engines, just to see what would happen.  Nothing ever did.
3. LN literally includes a book with lots of photos to assists first time installations.
4. Any questions or installation problems, the LN team is a phone call away and very helpful.
5. The LN units have a large installed base of successful installations, and a record of zero unit failures in the field.  No similar information (or installed base) is available for the Guldenberg system to my knowledge. 

Sometimes, like when the life of your engine depends upon the outcome, component cost should not be the limiting factor in decision making...………...

[Citgot]

Good points. As I stated in the OP I don’t want to be a test pilot for this kind of parts. LN sure has good reputation and can provide a lot of statistics of their products. There is sure worth in that.

Maybe time will tell if competitors can show some similar success records.

[JFP in PA]

11 minutes ago, Citgot said:

Good points. As I stated in the OP I don’t want to be a test pilot for this kind of parts. LN sure has good reputation and can provide a lot of statistics of their products. There is sure worth in that.

Maybe time will tell if competitors can show some similar success records.

 

It always remain a possibility that tomorrow will bring the proverbial "better mousetrap".

 

Funny story about LN's IMS products:  Every kit includes a numbered sticker to be mounted on the driver's door frame to demonstrate that the vehicle has been retrofitted, always a plus at resale or trade in time.  These became so desirable that counterfeit stickers began to show up online so that dubious owners could try to trick unsuspecting buyers.  To counter this, LN developed a web site where you can key in either the sticker number, or the VIN number of the vehicle, and the site would tell you if the number was real and give you the VIN number of the car it was installed in, or if you only had a VIN, it would tell you if the car had ever been retrofitted, what product was used, and the date of the installation.

 

Copying has always been the sincerest form of flattery...………….

[hi8ha]

In the event I need to replace/retrofit the IMS on my 99 996, isthere a shop in Miami that can do it?

[JFP in PA]

7 minutes ago, hi8ha said:

In the event I need to replace/retrofit the IMS on my 99 996, isthere a shop in Miami that can do it?

 

I would suggest contacting LN Engineering, they have a list of preferred installers all over the country.

[hi8ha]

Thanks!!!

[YellowJacketGS]

In the event I need to replace/retrofit the IMS on my 99 996, isthere a shop in Miami that can do it?

Looks like only one in FL - Fort Myers - according to their website. Maybe it’s outdated.

[JFP in PA]

13 hours ago, YellowJacketGS said:

Looks like only one in FL - Fort Myers - according to their website. Maybe it’s outdated.

 

I believe that you will find that list is for the IMS Solution only, there is a sperate list for their ceramic hybrid retrofits.

[YellowJacketGS]

Still only one. I suppose many installers don’t bother getting the official certification.

[JFP in PA]

48 minutes ago, YellowJacketGS said:

Still only one. I suppose many installers don’t bother getting the official certification.

 

That is very true.  Many shops, mine included, while offered certification, never obtained it as it was both time consuming and expensive.  In reality, if your shop already had more business than it could handle, becoming certified really didn't offer you much.

[YellowJacketGS]

 
That is very true.  Many shops, mine included, while offered certification, never obtained it as it was both time consuming and expensive.  In reality, if your shop already had more business than it could handle, becoming certified really didn't offer you much.

Absolutely. When I got my IMS solution done last year I researched and found a reputable shop without fixating on a “certified” installer.

[dporto]

On 3/15/2020 at 6:04 PM, JFP in PA said:

 

It always remain a possibility that tomorrow will bring the proverbial "better mousetrap".

 

Funny story about LN's IMS products:  Every kit includes a numbered sticker to be mounted on the driver's door frame to demonstrate that the vehicle has been retrofitted, always a plus at resale or trade in time.  These became so desirable that counterfeit stickers began to show up online so that dubious owners could try to trick unsuspecting buyers.  To counter this, LN developed a web site where you can key in either the sticker number, or the VIN number of the vehicle, and the site would tell you if the number was real and give you the VIN number of the car it was installed in, or if you only had a VIN, it would tell you if the car had ever been retrofitted, what product was used, and the date of the installation.

 

Copying has always been the sincerest form of flattery...………….

 ^^^ But only if the install was registered by the installer ^^^ 

[JFP in PA]

On ‎3‎/‎29‎/‎2020 at 11:29 AM, dporto said:

 ^^^ But only if the install was registered by the installer ^^^ 

 

Most quality shops did, just as the followed their “preinstallation inspection “ directives, both of which benefited the car’s owner at no cost to the shops.  We regularly had customers ask us about both when shopping for someone to do the retrofit, signs of an informed consumer.  DIY’s on the other hand were another story.......