Constant engine ticking, should I be worried?

[pedenjohn]

bit of an update on this problem. ive discovered that the ticking stops when the oil filler cap is removed, yes realy :huh: any of you technical guys able to point me in the direction of any oil breathers for the engine which i could check?

When yoou remove the oil cap, the idle increases "ever so slightly" which as you explained earlier, eliminates the noise.

yea, i can see why your saying that, the idle becomes a little iratic, but i wouldnt say it raises the idle, certainly not on the gauge anyway. ive experimented with raising the idle alone and it takes a fair bit of an increase to remove the tick, much more noticible than slacking the oil cap, if that makes sense.

[llemtt]

...to me it sounds like a valve lifter, but its not as i have replaced all the lifters on the right hand bank from where it is coming...

hi there

my 98 C2 does the same ticking on the right bank at idle when warm and I am hearing everyday more and more people complaining about this noise when the engine gets older

I was thinking about a sort of lifter wearing, now I am glad to hear that replacement doesn't solve the problem cause luckily I never decided to do that and probably lifters (mines included) are ok and the problem lies somewhere else

my oil pressure at idle when warm is somehow low but still ok (1.2 - 1.5 bar)

changing oil from 0-40 to 5-50 maybe can ease the problem

but now question is: why only right bank do make noise?

Teo

[tac27]

Anyone have a diagram or photo showing where the EGR vavle is located? I'd like to try this possible solution to clicking noise on my 996.

[Krokodil]

My 2007 Cayman S (M97.20 engine) developed the similar/same "tick" that was intially random and finally became constant. Over the next week or so the car developed several other noises that sounded like the exhaust/heat shield rattling. After some investigation the transmission was removed and the DM flywheel was found to have failied (the car is raced). Our hope, therefore, was that this failure was the root of all evil. Unfortunately it was not, and when the car was back on the ground all of the noises were still present.

Other symptoms included occasional rough idle and hesitation.

Further investigation focused on the lifters and other valve train components, as the ticking noise certainly sounded like a lifter, and the problem was identifed as a failed hydraulic actuator in the variocam system (996 105 301 XX). The part was repaired/replaced and all nosies are now gone. It appears that the tick was a sticking actuator and the coincident noises were the chains, etc. flailing around as a result of improper postioning/tension (speculation). These noises did not develop until the actuator failed completely.

I will not share the shops secrets for isolating the problem, but if you contact Dwain Dement at Vision Motorsports in Laguna Hills, CA (949.770.2888) I am sure he can help you resolve your issue.

Cheers,

[llemtt]

... and the problem was identifed as a failed hydraulic actuator in the variocam system (996 105 301 XX). The part was repaired/replaced and all nosies are now gone. It appears that the tick was a sticking actuator and the coincident noises were the chains, etc. flailing around as a result of improper postioning/tension (speculation). These noises did not develop until the actuator failed completely...

Good explanation, I am more and more convinced that the idle ticking on the right bank isn't a bad tapped but something related to other components or a lubrication problem (clogged duct?).

However those parts doesn't belong to the 3.4 (996) engine, they are part of the improved variocam (plus) of the 3.6 version, so my problem actually should be a different one :(

cheers

Teo

[Krokodil]

... and the problem was identifed as a failed hydraulic actuator in the variocam system (996 105 301 XX). The part was repaired/replaced and all nosies are now gone. It appears that the tick was a sticking actuator and the coincident noises were the chains, etc. flailing around as a result of improper postioning/tension (speculation). These noises did not develop until the actuator failed completely...

Good explanation, I am more and more convinced that the idle ticking on the right bank isn't a bad tapped but something related to other components or a lubrication problem (clogged duct?).

However those parts doesn't belong to the 3.4 (996) engine, they are part of the improved variocam (plus) of the 3.6 version, so my problem actually should be a different one :(

cheers

Teo

Teo,

The problem could be the same. The 3.4 in the Cayman has the variocam plus head. It is different from the 3.4 in the 996.

Cheers,

[llemtt]

...The problem could be the same. The 3.4 in the Cayman has the variocam plus head. It is different from the 3.4 in the 996.

...

Sorry I created a little bit of misunderstanding... mine is a 3.4 996 :(

I have just read another thread saying that by overfilling oil by 0.5 quart noise disappears! Now I am even more confused about possible causes.

Teo

[RFM]

Reading too much is too confusing, fill the engine up with approved oil to the specified level and check for noise. If the noise is still there, let check the engine in a dealership or independent.

[lmurthwaite]

Hi all, I have been a victim of this issue too. It maybe just me, but my car seems worse if I have given it a bit of a heavy right foot and I am in manual mode on my Tip. The last time it happened to me was after a good fast drive. The car was warmed up enough. I pulled into a petrol station and the noise was awful. I was convinced I had broken a big end bearing or piston ring. The noise, as with all others seems to come from the right bank behind the muffler. When I listen in from the top of the engine (through the hood) I cannot really hear the noise as much. I had my Oil Separator replaced last year and it does seem to be worse since then. I believe the car was replenished with 5W40 Mobil 1. I am thinking of doing an oil and filter change with 0W40 to see if that makes a difference. It does make me nervous about putting my foot down.

I have a 1998 3.4 C2 tip (some say Carrera S, but I don't have any evidence of the S anywhere on the car).

Has there been any further investigation done by anyone on the site?

What could happen to the engine if I used 15W40 instead of 0W40, what do the numbers actually mean? Does 0W40 begin thinner and remain as thin when it heats up where 15W40 is thicker when cold and gets thinner when hot?

[RFM]

The figures in front of the W(inter) means the oil viscosity index (oil thickness) in cold condition: 0 is thinner than 15.

The figures behind the W means the oil viscosity index in hot condition: 40 is in both examples the same.

[minny]

My'99 C2 Tip also had a tick like you described. It was at the right bank that was present all the time. Soft in volume (like a screwdriver tapped against the head) but speeded up as you revved the engine Spoke to all the specialists and they figured it was a lazy lifter. Left the car in to be serviced and it turned out to be a sightly loose spark plug. I fix cars myself but this one was new to me and the specialist including the main dealer. Anyway, happy ending as there was no damage to the head.

Edited May 28, 2009 by minny

[Kel]

Ticking at idle when warm, rev it it goes away - my 72klms old 98 year build 996 3.4ltr Manual has same problem. Went in for new lifters. No fix... Discovery is that the 5th cylinder gudgeon bush is worn/damaged - a not uncommon problem I am told. Car uses no oil, otherwise runs very well. Engine in process of tear down now as I can not be sure of time to total failure. Tick has become worse over last 4klms. Devastating outcome on such a low mileage car that has had no other issues. By the way when lifters replaced has issues with exhaust manifold bolts breaking off in dissassembly and v. worn timing chain ramp.

Buying a reman is not an option - the LN Eng. options seem good if there is an bore issues. will get LN Eng IM shaft/bearing upgrades as a minimum.

Kel

[BruceP]

Can someone explain to me why using an oil with higher cold viscosity would make any difference to the way the engine runs when it's warm? Every oil option being discussed here has the same warm viscosity. Confused.

[BruceP]

What could happen to the engine if I used 15W40 instead of 0W40, what do the numbers actually mean? Does 0W40 begin thinner and remain as thin when it heats up where 15W40 is thicker when cold and gets thinner when hot?

My understanding as to why Porsche prefers lighter cold viscosities is that the valve gear gets lubricated faster on startup. Variocam is supposedly very sensitive to lubrication.

I have zero interest in covering old ground about which cold viscosity to use. I've made my choice. But I find the latter argument to be very persuasive in any case, and would personally be anxious about a cold viscosity of 15, for example.

[llemtt]

gudgeon bush is worn/damaged - a not uncommon problem I am told

Can you please explain to me what's a "gudgeon bush" ?

tia

[whall]

tia,

A "gudgeon" is a piston's wrist pin. A "bush" refers to, I think, a bushing (bearing) associated with the piston/wrist pin assembly.

Bill

[jbrewer]

My'99 C2 Tip also had a tick like you described. It was at the right bank that was present all the time. Soft in volume (like a screwdriver tapped against the head) but speeded up as you revved the engine Spoke to all the specialists and they figured it was a lazy lifter. Left the car in to be serviced and it turned out to be a sightly loose spark plug. I fix cars myself but this one was new to me and the specialist including the main dealer. Anyway, happy ending as there was no damage to the head.

Thanks Minny! I had similar ticking sound that was so distinctive that it had me concerned I might be in for a huge expense. Can't tell you how happy I was to find a loose spark plug! Tightened up on the plug and the ticking is gone.

I'll have to make another donation to RennTech.Org! :renntech:

[Kel]

The ticking was indeed a gudgeon bush. On dissassmbly, the conrond could be moved on the piston by hand. Bore was oval 4+ thou. Other cylinders and gudgeons also showing similar signs.

Hartech (see elsehwere on here) theorises that this ovality is precursor to D chunking of #2 and #5.

Car (3.4 man 996) had done 72,000 klms in 10 years since new. Used no oil. Ran well, but had a "lifter noise" when warm at idle. Started to become a hard metallic, unfriendly noise.

Disappeared with revs. Thicker oil quietened it.

Torn down - now has LN Eng Nickies, JE forged pistons 3.6litre with IS upgrade and other durability mods.

Bore thickness vs. std. is - O/D of cylinder std. is 110mm, OD with the 3.6 litre Nickies - 115mm and the Nickies are said to be stronger cylinder material. So 2.5mm thicker wall, stronger Al. cylinders and a larger bore..

Got to say that it is fast...esp. with 12:1 compression.

Another car in the shop, similar vintage, same 3.4 996 motor being torn down had same oval bore issue - again well represented by the Hartech article.

After assembly and drive for a day - had intermixing. Used the Brad Penn 30w run in oil as recommended by LN. Theory is maybe too much oil pressure with new motor and stressed the old oil coller. Oil pressure at 75+psi vs water at 23 psi meant that the oil traffic was one way into the coolant (yes water and oil pass through the cooler in seperate chambers - it ruptured.)

Oil in water - no water in oil. A pain to fix - removal of radiators, a days flushing, disconnect, regas air etc let alone more work in the engine bay...

My advice - this is another dodgy Porsche part - change it if your car is several years old and is still on the original.

I read on here people give up on their engines from intermixing quickly and think the worst- like cylinder head or bores... Try the oil cooler if you have no water in the oil and its just oil in the coolant.