Generator / Alternator failure ctt 06

[lewisweller]

As if my ctt didn't already have me well invested....... today the wife's calls to say dash warning say "battery/generator fault". FYI I think this might well be the root cause to my many gremlins like "check tail lights and licence plate lights" when below 13.2 volts and "four wheel drive faulty" and engine hesitation !! 

She drove it straight home and parked it. 

I checked the battery (new in Feb 2016) voltage showed 12.4 volts this is low I know, started up ok (ran very poor) but charging is 12v off load and 11.85v with lights on, so Alternator is caput! When tested before a few weeks ago was 13.72v off load and 13.2 on load.

Unless someone has any other viable possibilities? Heard of main cable fault on earlier models and fuse? 

 

So assuming all other possibilities get ruled out I'm looking for a re-manufactured alternator, there seems to be loads of revisions and different part number across the 2003-2006 yrs, but I'm sure mine is pn 95560301610 autoatlanta listing  or 948603015 ECS Tuning listing) (190amp option code I8GY as per the specification print out from Porsche for my car).

Some I found are 150amps and others for the earlier years which I think had a different electrical connector fitted?

 

So question I'm asking is which Bosch of other brand remanufactured part is the right one for my alternator? 

 

Tech Info Appreciated.  And some R+R DIY advice pls......

[clarksongli]

AL9420X

[Mike Markota]

I am on the midst of this replacement right now..I am on my phone now but will reply with some notes once I get back to the garage and my computer. 

[lewisweller]

I just confirmed with Porsche and the revised part is 94860301505 with some 5 other parts which are screws, pipe fitting and heat shield which is the conversion to the updated alternator. Porsche want 6448dhs which is $1750! OMG. I found a remanufactured one on eBay UK for £139 plus exchange old one, bargain as mother is flying over on Sunday . 

Some advise for fitting would be good, I found a 2 part PDF instruction but the picture or rather diagrams from Porsche manual are terrible to follow. 

Anybody swapped their original alternator and used the revision one with a few changes as per Porsche recommendation?  

I'm hoping this goes smooth.........

[ekstroemtj]

Just can tell you what my mechanic told me when he changed mine: hope you dont come again with such a job.

need hands like a child because its tight. 

Some recommand to take away all front to get access. He just take away the right wheel and the whell well liner. Took him about 5 hours the job. 

[ekstroemtj]

This is acctually a very good offer. I payed for a remanufatured from DELPHI arround 350 Euro and this was even very low comparing what Porsche is asking for

[lewisweller]

23 hours ago, Mike Markota said:

I am on the midst of this replacement right now..I am on my phone now but will reply with some notes once I get back to the garage and my computer. 

How did you, or are you, getting on with the alternator swap my friend?

Did you skip the move to service position step like some have done? I think this just give extra space to wrestle the alternator out and down through the bottom?

Im kinda going to wing it a bit, do the obvious steps and clear the way and see how I get on without the service position.

Any advise appreciated................... 

[Mike Markota]

Sorry for the delay in responding!

 

I did put the car in the service position. It is just so tight. I was also wary of investing too much time in any short cuts in the and having to put  in the service position anyhow. It is only an extra hour of work tops. Presumably much less frustration, as the extra few inches are really helpful. Just grab some m10x1.5x100 (or longer) bolts and its not so bad.

 

The alternator swap is a pain in the ***.. Not difficult, just.. tight quarters and lots and lots of removal of everything around it.  I used a number of resources to help me through it. The instructions (which I will link to) were very good, though I had trouble removing the alternator through the wheel housing as the manual suggested. Instead I removed the intercooler outlet pipe and wiggled it out through the top pretty effortlessly. 

 

 

I used this link:

 

http://rennlist.com/forums/porsche-cayenne-forum/875662-2004-955-ctt-alternator-generator-replacement-upgrade.html

 

The author included 2 pdfs of the workshop manuals which I am including here. Also included in that thread is a pdf for putting the car into the service position. The connector part numbers listed there did not work for my car. I have those for sale if anyone wants those. I had to order 948-106-362-01 (the small straight fitting on the alternator) and 948-106-050-01 (the bigger plastic fitting on the alternator, comes with 2 hoses attached) 

 

I followed all the steps with the exception of removing the  radiator hose and removing the alternator through the wheel opening. Instead I left the hose on and snaked the alternator through the top. 

 

The intercooler pipe I mentioned earlier has a twin on the drivers side which is nearly impossible to get to with the front of the car assembled, so I figured it was a good time to replace those seals. The part number for those seals is WHT 001 018 , you'll  want two of those. 

 

While the pressure pipes are out its worth replacing those o-rings as well, 955-110-721-00 (big end) and 955-110-720-00 (small side)

 

I also put in a new water pump because it is literally staring you in the face with nothing else keeping it on when the belt is off and the coolant is drained.

 

Good luck! I hope to never be there again

 

 

 

 

Alternator11.pdf

Alternator12.pdf

[lewisweller]

On 7 September 2016 at 8:40 PM, Mike Markota said:

Sorry for the delay in responding!

 

I did put the car in the service position. It is just so tight. I was also wary of investing too much time in any short cuts in the and having to put  in the service position anyhow. It is only an extra hour of work tops. Presumably much less frustration, as the extra few inches are really helpful. Just grab some m10x1.5x100 (or longer) bolts and its not so bad.

 

The alternator swap is a pain in the ***.. Not difficult, just.. tight quarters and lots and lots of removal of everything around it.  I used a number of resources to help me through it. The instructions (which I will link to) were very good, though I had trouble removing the alternator through the wheel housing as the manual suggested. Instead I removed the intercooler outlet pipe and wiggled it out through the top pretty effortlessly. 

 

 

I used this link:

 

http://rennlist.com/forums/porsche-cayenne-forum/875662-2004-955-ctt-alternator-generator-replacement-upgrade.html

 

The author included 2 pdfs of the workshop manuals which I am including here. Also included in that thread is a pdf for putting the car into the service position. The connector part numbers listed there did not work for my car. I have those for sale if anyone wants those. I had to order 948-106-362-01 (the small straight fitting on the alternator) and 948-106-050-01 (the bigger plastic fitting on the alternator, comes with 2 hoses attached) 

 

I followed all the steps with the exception of removing the  radiator hose and removing the alternator through the wheel opening. Instead I left the hose on and snaked the alternator through the top. 

 

The intercooler pipe I mentioned earlier has a twin on the drivers side which is nearly impossible to get to with the front of the car assembled, so I figured it was a good time to replace those seals. The part number for those seals is WHT 001 018 , you'll  want two of those. 

 

While the pressure pipes are out its worth replacing those o-rings as well, 955-110-721-00 (big end) and 955-110-720-00 (small side)

 

I also put in a new water pump because it is literally staring you in the face with nothing else keeping it on when the belt is off and the coolant is drained.

 

Good luck! I hope to never be there again

 

 

 

 

Alternator11.pdf

Alternator12.pdf

Thanks markota for updating and congrats on a successful swap. 

Today I'm driving the car to my warehouse where I will do the work after the weekend, I hope the battery will last the 25 minute journey or I'll be calling a recovery....

 

A side note, when the  garage did my head gaskets the valves covers had been leaking for a long time, the Oil and middle east sand had caked the alternator totally, i was surprised it worked! This is testament to the water cooling as no air could get near it. I wish the alternator had failed then as the whole engine was out on the floor and the garage removed and totally cleaned the alternator but hey these things are sent to try us. Character building jobs...............lol

 

 

 

[lewisweller]

Got the car to my warehouse without breaking down, what I did notice is how dramatic the running difference is with alternator not charging and the battery dying, the idle was up around 1000rpm fluctuating and acceleration was noticeably laboured with gear shifts a bit abrupt even though I drove it very smooth and tickled the throttle all the way coasting to slow and barely touched the brake. so im really hoping with a fresh alternator and the already nearly new battery a lot, if not all my remaining gremlins are going to vanish!

 

This list is:

Hesitation under acceleration

"Check tail light" when I touch the brake

random "check licence plate light"

"four wheel drive system faulty"

AC compressor recently cutting out or wont cut in when first starting engine

no fault codes except the recurring "Electrical load intervention" which I now think is cryptic for "fyi car owner one day your alternator will fail" .................lol

[lewisweller]

On 7 September 2016 at 8:40 PM, Mike Markota said:

 

The alternator is out and omg what a lovely job it was to remove. 

I didn't put the front end into service position but I hazard a guess it may have made life a little easier. The alternator came out of the wheel arch where the air box usually sits, I managed to catch all my Coolant which was new a few months back so bet your *** it's going back in! 

New Alternator arrives tomorrow via mothers express vacation delivery care Package......

 

As you can see from the picture the inside insulation has crumbled and melted into a paste. Yuck, I cleaned it up ready to send back as eBay item was exchange type deal. 

 

 

[ekstroemtj]

Well done!!! Hope your hands dont have to much scratches because of this tight job

[lewisweller]

Well the alternator is done! What a total nightmare of a job, the new (reconditioned) alternator was marginally bigger than the old one and I spent literally 2 hrs getting it back in, hands are a mess right now. 

Started her up with the assistance of a battery off my diesel generator, and after a few mins disconnected the donor battery and tested the charging voltage a healthy stable 13.6volts, made the whole ordeal worth it. 

 

Topping off coolant tomorrow and clear codes, throttle alignment etc and a quick wash before going for a blast to see how it runs now and excited to see if the other gremlins have actually disappeared or not. 

 

Couple things to note, the coolant pipe connector on the new Alternator was different and I had to modify it to fit the bolt hole (third picture) and it also was orientated differently meaning it faced up and towards the right fender (second picture new alternator and connectors reused) as opposed to towards the front bumper(first picture original alternator fitment). Luckily by opening out the hole on the plastic retaining as much metal insert as possible for strength, cutting the spigot slightly shorter and rerouting the coolant hose I was able to reuse the existing fittings with just new O-rings. Porsche here is shut for 4 days Muslim holiday, (I wasn't being stingy reusing the parts and I wasn't waiting 4 days either..............impatient).

I also did not reinstall the pointless extra half moon shape metal part that bolts on the alternator and curves around the pulley, I just made sure the pipes etc all were secure and can't rub or touch any rotating parts. The boost hoses removed I replaced the O-rings whilst there and I also replaced front brake pads for brembo (pagid) originals, and the passenger side upper suspension arm which had play in it and as you can see the ball joint socket was oval! (Picture four) I broke it getting it out, had to beat it, tight as ****. 

 

Thanks to posting members for support and I hope none of you ever have to do this job. 

 

 

[ekstroemtj]

Congrats. Free electricity for the next years. I hope!!!

 

I remember you give your ViN to be shure to get the right replacement part.

how possible you got a part which needed to be modified to fit?

if it happens to me i would be lost with this extra work.

 

if there is time, please could you explain how you changed this upper control arms.

 

[lewisweller]

Today recalibrated the air suspension ride height as the front was sitting too low following the alternator works. 

On the way home earlier got near the house and coasted to the roundabout and felt the steering go heavy and then realised the car had shut off mid cornering. Managed to roll up the front of my building and dump it. 

Tried to restart and starter does a half turn and stops, classic dead battery. 

I tried to jump start of the audi but whilst doing so I had the Vagcom do a full scan, no surprise some codes all relating to low voltage fuse 30, no communication, steering angle sensor ambient air temp fault etc all new codes never seen before, after leaving it on the jumpers tried again and watched the voltage drop to 8volts and split second cranking and nothing. So my new battery in Feb is dead. Im thinking the alternator failure also screwed up the battery over the last 6 months and dropped a cell. Will chuck in a new one on saturday and see all is ok. 

 

What's weird is why did the car cut out whilst driving without warning? Could have been a dangerous situation. 

[ekstroemtj]

When cut of no warning light on the display? 

 

When my alternator was gone almost the same. Battery low because no charging. I saw the warning on the display. But when batterie almost dead and alternator not working. My car stopped driving after some hundred meters.

[lewisweller]

20 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

When cut of no warning light on the display? 

 

When my alternator was gone almost the same. Battery low because no charging. I saw the warning on the display. But when batterie almost dead and alternator not working. My car stopped driving after some hundred meters.

No warning on dash, no indication it was going to die, started and ran Ok about 15 mins before when I left my business partners office just a few kms away. 

 

I just whipped it out of the car earlier, no signs of leaks or damage, looks like a brand new battery as you would expect. 

Will try to blag a warranty replacement as it's only six months old, bit cheeky but worth a crack. Cost new is 750dhs about $200. 

 

 

[lewisweller]

Got the new battery as a warranty replacement for the 6 month old one. They sent it to be tested they said, it failed the test but no details why exactly given. 

Put in the new battery Varta brand 110amp 900cca the Proper battery I'm sure just like the old one was too. All I get is click and a minute turn like 1/4" of the timing chain when view led through through oil filler cap removed. So wtf!!

I even tried to jump start of the audi again and same click, dash lights flash off. 

 

So what would cause this? Stalled engine which wouldn't crank to start, a failed battery replaced and still no start even with jumpers?

 

Possibles:

1. New battery no charge (measures just 12volts which I know is low but even jumpers of audi didn't crank it)

 

2. Starter motor  is dead, bad battery is a coincidence or a by product visa versa? But Why did the car stall?

 

3. Other possible fault that could stop it cracking are?? But still allow it to engage and turn a few mm.

 

Losing the will to live............... 

 

[wizard]

Whilst possibly the starter motor, I'd be inclined to look at the starter relay. Other possibles to check are the connections on the battery circuit to starter. I wouldn't rule out a faulty ignition switch if it's none of the foregoing.

 

The stall whilst driving was presumably the result of the failed alternator and a progressively drained battery.

 

Keep your spirits up !

Edited September 17, 2016 by wizard

[lewisweller]

30 minutes ago, wizard said:

Whilst possibly the starter motor, I'd be inclined to look at the starter relay. Other possibles to check are the connections on the battery circuit to starter. I wouldn't rule out a faulty ignition switch if it's none of the foregoing.

 

The stall whilst driving was presumably the result of the failed alternator and a progressively drained battery.

 

Keep your spirits up !

What was puzzling this happened a fews days after the alternator was installed. I had started and driven the car several times since and noticed no issue. 

Where is the starter relay located and would or could a bad relay make the starter clunk click slightly and not crank over? The ignition switch crossed my mind but as my understanding would go I wouldn't get any click clunk partial crank at all if the ignition switch wasn't working?

 I'm inclined to think the starter is jammed or the engine has an issue which is preventing rotation heaven forbid like seized up!?  

As the starter removal is looking like a 1 hour job now I'm so used to working on this PIG I think just for the hell of it im going in there anyway. I intend to remove, bench test and strip and clean all components of the starter, assuming good function will not be replacing it. 

Hey thomas will be replacing my vacuum pipe at the back too lol will take some snaps for you, maybe your next diy job? 

 

[ekstroemtj]

I feel very sorry about your story. I go through similar problems with my first cayenne and now with the turbo.  I can imagine what you feel.

 

dont make me scary . I would like to have a trouble free time with this car.  I just come back from garage. Again half weekend on the car

[lewisweller]

Starter is out and guess what it works just fine on the bench! WTF

Took it apart and the brushes are like new plenty of life left in the old girl. reassembled after a clean up and retested perfect.

 

so 3 possible issues:

1. The starter is ok until put under load

2. The engine is seized and the starter cant turn it over (tomorrow will turn the engine manually and disconnect the drive belt to spin alternator water pump and ac pulley to make sure nothing is seized)

3. The new battery plus jump starting of my spare battery and the Audi is also not enough power to crank the V8 over.  

 

Tomorrow will put it back in  the car and try to crank it over direct off the starter with spare battery after I confirm the engine is turning manually freely.

 

I got a theory of the sequence, the battery failed on Thursday and the car stalled, cranking wouldn't work as defective battery was too far gone, then the new battery came with a low state of charge and despite jump starting there isn't enough juice to get it to turn over?? I don't have a battery charger which is a huge PITA, so tomorrow have to buy one FFS.

 

 

[lewisweller]

Right forget the starter. The ****ING new Alternator is seized tight hence won't crank over. 

Now started striping down the alternator again. I'm gonna be screwed either way because I got two broken alternators and probably a eBay seller who won't want to know about any of it. Imagine the air freight to send me another one. 

 

On a brighter note I found another check valve which doesn't work! 

[lewisweller]

Alternator is out and stripped, total junk inside, the main bearing has spun inside the front casing overheated and seized the whole thing up as well as cracking it. The pulley then rubbed against the cover plate jamming everything. 

The eBay seller has agreed to "sort this out". Needless to say I'm really tired of taking this thing apart although I got it down to just 60 minutes with 30 minutes to wrestle the thing out the tight space. 

Some interesting info is the new unit is Delphi and the old was Hitachi. Delphi is larger, diameter wise, and a real b**ch to get in and out. Hitachi was a piece of cake in contrast. I've ask the eBay seller to send me what I actually ordered in the first place which is the Hitachi type, despite him saying the Delphi is more reliable, I disagree after striping both units the Hitachi is much better made. 

[lewisweller]

New Hitachi 94860301505 alternator bought on Amazon UK earlier £385 should receive it next week. Remanufactured junk Delphi Alternator going back to UK eBay seller with full refund. 

 

So new Alternator, new battery, serviced perfect condition starter motor, new coils, spark plugs, water pump aux belt and pulleys, purge valve, gas cap, n75 valve, changeover valve, new DV's, more vac pipes hoses and check valves than I can count, new head gaskets and all the trimmings, steering rack end Seals, trans filter & oil and diffs oils  what else could possibly go wrong! Ha ha stupid question. ....... could of bought the Q5 3.0t by now