Turbo / MAF replacement, Oil found

[ekstroemtj]

maybe some professionals could please have a look to the OBD readings and try to analyze the values. 

Actual lamda value bank 1 and bank 2 so different numbers but i cant interpret.

 

[hahnmgh63]

For idle I think your MAF reading is fine. Your Lambda values are close (Equivalence ratio). Not sure what the first two Lambda ones are as the 102.39 makes no sense. Lamda or 1 = 14.7 to 1 A/F ratio, optimum burn. Optimum power is a little richer around 12.8 to 13.2 to 1 which is where a Cayenne on Wide Open throttle will run, we'll call it about Lambda .87 to .90.  It would be interesting to see those two Equivalence ratio's on WOT when you're making power. See if your program has instructions to see what the meanings of the Actual Lambda values in the first pics are as they should be close to the same on both banks. The Equivalence ratio reading say S1 which means coming from the first (Wide Band on Turbos) O2 sensor which is what you want, pre-cat.

[ekstroemtj]

Thank you Mark. 

The OBD device is a Icarsoft. I will see if i can find some explanation. 

My Durametric cable doesnt read the values at all. Dont know why. 

I will see how the reading is under WOT. Will try tomorrow

[Ddavidoff]

Wow. Great thread. Just read the whole thing as I have an 08 CTT with similar issues. Found a few broken vacuum parts and replaced, but still similar issues.


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[lewisweller]

 

Thomas your data pretty much is saying at idle the car is running fine. 

Your issue are during acceleration same as me. To see what your lambda sensors are showing by way of a graph would help diagnose if either or both sensors are working correctly or not. 

The fact you have overboost code tell me that your problem revolves around the turbo piping, the wastegate or the manifold area pipes. 

have you tried removing those flexible hoses connecting from bank 1 and 2, and the pipe 5 I had split also I assume the small check valves you check when replacing the silicon hoses the other day? 

Lastly as we was emailing earlier you said the whistle noise started after replacing the driver side DV, time to jump back in there and recheck everything again top to bottom. 

 

Whistle noise is almost always a boost leak, when boost is leaking out the dme holds the wastegate shut longer to build up the boost it wants to see in the manifold, when you shut the throttle it will spike up and over boost code will pop up, then performance is reduce until you switch ignition off or reset the dtc. 

 

When you have the turbo inlet pipe off, feel the turbo impellor wheel for play, there should be no movement side to side up and down. A small amount of movement in and out is acceptable. Also spin the impellor and check it's not rubbing and also spins freely. 

A faulty worn turbo can cause overboost as well. 

[GrandeOak]

On 11/27/2016 at 8:48 AM, ekstroemtj said:

i changed almost every pipe which is possible. 

 

 

 

 

What type of replacement hose did you use? If you know the size that would be great too.

 

I have heard mixed opinions on using silicon pneumatic for vacuum lines. 

 

Great thread by the way. I think lots of folks are rooting for you both to find a solution.

[ekstroemtj]

29 minutes ago, GrandeOak said:

 

What type of replacement hose did you use? If you know the size that would be great too.

 

I have heard mixed opinions on using silicon pneumatic for vacuum lines. 

 

Great thread by the way. I think lots of folks are rooting for you both to find a solution.

 

Hi 

 

glad if all this posts bring us to a solution in the end. Same time i am very glad for any input.  Someone may ask why i just bring it to the service point and let it get fixed. My experience with this kind of problems usually ending up with days of labour and sometimes no solution. When i take my first Cayenne to the shop because of random PSM failures they changed almost everything and guess what: the problems still came back frequently.  

Thats why i want to try to fix this by myself with your help.  Maybe day will come and i give up on it and give it away. I am not on this point yet.  

 

I used pipes with the same diameter like the original ones.

Heat resistant up to 240 degrees celcius.

 

pressure lines from N75 valve to wastegate: inside diameter 4 mm. 

Many small pipes arround the y pipe have same size.

 

the bigger pipes which you see on the pictures from yesterday have 9 mm inside and they fit very good and tight. 

 

One pipe which is going  from the change over valve at the back of the engine along the fuel rail on drivers side to the front is 6 mm inside diameter.

[ekstroemtj]

49 minutes ago, GrandeOak said:

 

What type of replacement hose did you use? If you know the size that would be great too.

 

I have heard mixed opinions on using silicon pneumatic for vacuum lines. 

 

Great thread by the way. I think lots of folks are rooting for you both to find a solution.

 

You believe its abad solution to use silicon  pipes? 

[GrandeOak]

37 minutes ago, ekstroemtj said:

 

You believe its abad solution to use silicon  pipes? 

I am no expert in this area but have read where some folks (not necessarily with a Cayenne) have had silicon hoses collapse when used for vacuum lines.

 

I suppose it depends on the thickness of the hose and the vehicle. I hope it works for you. The zip ties will surely fail before the hose.

 

Thanks for the information on the hoses. If the hose works for you it will surely help many whether they have a leak or as a "while you are in there" item.

[ekstroemtj]

shame on me

i made a very big mistake. Because of my ongoing problems Our Specialist Lewis ask me this days if i am shure that my Diverter Valve which i changed in summertime is mounted in the right way.  I didnt even think about that it was possible to do something wrong. But i did. IDIOT stupid me. It was installed upside down. I only hope i didnt to much damage to my turbo charger. I could bite my .....

Edited November 30, 2016 by ekstroemtj

[lewisweller]

7 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

shame on me

i made a very big mistake. Because of my ongoing problems Our Specialist Lewis ask me this days if i am shure that my Diverter Valve which i changed in summertime is mounted in the right way.  I didnt even think about that it was possible to do something wrong. But i did. IDIOT stupid me. It was installed upside down. I only hope i didnt to much damage to my turbo charger. I could bite my .....

And the test drive results? Whistle noise gone? Overboost code still popping up? Engine Power back to full or still down? 

The suspense is killing me............lol

 

For reference the driver side DV vac pipe nipple connection points to the floor when installed correctly. Pic 1. 

 

The passenger side DV vac pipe nipple points to the rear of the car when installed correctly. Pic 2

 

 

Easy way to check is the boost from turbo outlet enters from the side of the dv and vents out the bottom back to the turbo inlet. 

 

Edited December 1, 2016 by lewisweller

[ekstroemtj]

Changed the DV Valve into the right position. Pressure line position down like it must be. What a pita. Thats the result if working to fast and not careful. ****. My mistake. Took me again hours because everything so tight there. Again oil in the turbo to intercooler hose. Maybe normal. 

Did just short testdrive. 0 degrees and difficult road. Power and throttle response better but there is still this whistle noise when accelerating harder. Still somewhere a leak. 

[ekstroemtj]

On 20.11.2016 at 7:20 AM, Zakowsky said:

OK, one quick paranoid question - it's ready to take off, but to get the pin out to remove the Y tube you have to disconnect the electrical connection to the throttle body. If the engine is off and the key is out, will I have to have reset any codes after doing this? There seems to be something wrong with my OBD2 connector...and I guess in general, can you disconnect electrical components on the engine when it is off without tripping a code? Or are there systems that are continuously monitored? Thanks!

 

 

...... actually you dont need to be concerned about the condition of your intake Y pipe. I checked the intake from both of my cayennes. They look the same inside. Makes me believe this is the standard. 

[ekstroemtj]

So guys i need your help here. 

Still affraid i could have a timing issue. I read the values with my durametric cable but i cant interpret the numbers. Maybe somebody can assist. 

The lower numbers are at idle and the higher ones ar 2000 rpm.

[ekstroemtj]

readings see below please

 

Edited December 4, 2016 by ekstroemtj

[ekstroemtj]

Grafik

 

Edited December 4, 2016 by ekstroemtj

[lewisweller]

2 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

Grafik

 

Thomas from my understanding the difference can be from -6 to +6 deviation between each bank, you have only a few degrees at idle and at 2000rpm.

 

I your idle rough or smooth? If smooth you don't have a timing issue I very much doubt. 

 

Ignoring the codes. what are the bad running symptoms now? Pls try to explain how it runs when cold or hot and when idle, when accelerating, when cruising and when full Throttle blasting. 

[ekstroemtj]

hi again

 

the car is very smooth at idle. If cold or warm doesnt matter. If i push the pedal just slightly there is everything fine. Little bit harder and the rumbling is starting. Mostly somewhere between 1500 and 2500 rpm. Higher rpms i dont feel it. 

Sometimes i even think thats not rpm related. Its speed related.  There is just this specific range where possible to feel. Dont want to say its disappearing at higher speed but hard to feel. I cant run the car very hard and fast now. We have winter. Minus degrees and very difficult roads. Not a environment where to run a car that hard.

[lewisweller]

Keeping this thread alive after ordering 2nos precat wide band air/fuel sensors I eventually got one delivered to mothers uk address, it seems the supply issue which prevented me from sourcing in UAE Bosch distributor is the same as all these ebayer sellers who claim to have their own stock, the lying ****s! 

 

Anyway, if I trust the data, only the bank 1 sensor is "lazy" producing much less milli-amps when rich than it is supposed to during snap throttle which means all the data it's streaming back to the dme is false and hopefully when replaced it in a fortnight when it get here and I have time to fit it, it will finally cure the remaining hesitation running issue. 

 

The performance overall excuse the part load hesitation is very good, wide open throttle after 3,000rpm to redline is very powerful, throttle response now I fix the various intake pipes air leaks and refreshed the ignition and fuel system is also so much better. I even got over 400km on the last tank and fuel light wasn't even on when I refilled. The trip range said 710km, ha ha I do love the optimism. 500km could be a very distant target if I drove like an eco warrior. 

 

[ekstroemtj]

I hope you will get your best xmas present when the car is running like new after your sensor change.

[ekstroemtj]

I needed to take out my battery to charge it. No Plug in down in the parking deck. I use a onother one with just 60 AH for today. Car Starts and runs. Thanks god. 

Which surprise. After disconnecting the battery my car was running again better than before. What the heck is this. Every cut in Power makes it run better for some time. 

Edited December 9, 2016 by ekstroemtj

[Zakowsky]

3 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

I needed to take out my battery to charge it. No Plug in down in the parking deck. I use a onother one with just 60 AH for today. Car Starts and runs. Thanks god. 

Which surprise. After disconnecting the battery my car was running again better than before. What the heck is this. Every cut in Power makes it run better for some time. 

 

Does turning PSM off change anything? It seems to over ride some of the adaptations on mine.

[lewisweller]

8 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

I needed to take out my battery to charge it. No Plug in down in the parking deck. I use a onother one with just 60 AH for today. Car Starts and runs. Thanks god. 

Which surprise. After disconnecting the battery my car was running again better than before. What the heck is this. Every cut in Power makes it run better for some time. 

Thomas when did you last remove the throttle body and clean it? 

This is yours from your picture and I noticed its quite dirty. 

This isn't going to cure all your problems but may help or at least not add to the problems. 

As we emailed get a new battery 11.57volts is a dead dead battery, new purge valve and take the valve cover off and check the camshaft pick up tabs and possibly leaking spark plug hole gasket. It will be you Xmas present to yourself. 

Edited December 10, 2016 by lewisweller

[ekstroemtj]

Lewis...

 

throttle body looks so bad?

 

how can you be shure its the purge valve? Cant it be the evap canister which is sitting in the wheel housing behind?

 

 

[lewisweller]

5 hours ago, ekstroemtj said:

Lewis...

 

throttle body looks so bad?

 

how can you be shure its the purge valve? Cant it be the evap canister which is sitting in the wheel housing behind?

 

 

Yes that's dirty I think. A quick clean is 30 mins of your time and a quick throttle body adaption in your software. 

The codes p0444 and p0441 are both indicative of the purge valve fault and not the evap. http://repairpal.com/obd-ii-code-P0444

This tech info also confirms my suspicions. Unless you gas cap is also not sealing or missing? (unlikely it would make both codes).