Can a clutch die overnight?

[Enlai Chu]

Hi everyone!

 

I have a stick-shift (manual) 2002 Porsche 996 and I think the clutch was screwed up by a valet service but wanted to get your thoughts: "Can a clutch go from 'fine' to almost slipping in a day's worth of non-abusive driving?"

 

I had a valet service pick up my car 2 days ago and when they returned it to me, I noticed that depressing the clutch felt strange (spongy at the end of the range) and also the transmission engagment happened a lot higher (i.e. I had to lift the clutch higher for the car to start moving) than before. As I drove, I could tell that there was roughness in the engagement and definitely had to be a lot more careful to engage the gears as there was much less room between when the gears engaged and when the clutch was fully released.

 

I had no problems with my clutch before I handed the car over to the valet, and now there was a noticeable difference. The next day, I drove the car and the clutch engagement is now rough (I can literally hear grinding type sounds when I change gears and feel the vibration as well).

 

Question - did the valet screw up my clutch? Or could my clutch have reached the end of its useful life coincidentally? i.e. my car is 13 years old with 105k miles on it and I don't know when the last owner changed the clutch

 

Thanks!

Edited July 31, 2015 by Enlai Chu

[AWDGuy]

if it's the original clutch it could be a combination of things. in this case, an old clutch got some abuse it wasn't use to seeing and the the clutch wasn't able to take it.

[JFP in PA]

Hi everyone!

 

I have a stick-shift (manual) 2002 Porsche 996 and I think the clutch was screwed up by a valet service but wanted to get your thoughts: "Can a clutch go from 'fine' to almost slipping in a day's worth of non-abusive driving?"

 

I had a valet service pick up my car 2 days ago and when they returned it to me, I noticed that depressing the clutch felt strange (spongy at the end of the range) and also the transmission engagment happened a lot higher (i.e. I had to lift the clutch higher for the car to start moving) than before. As I drove, I could tell that there was roughness in the engagement and definitely had to be a lot more careful to engage the gears as there was much less room between when the gears engaged and when the clutch was fully released.

 

I had no problems with my clutch before I handed the car over to the valet, and now there was a noticeable difference. The next day, I drove the car and the clutch engagement is now rough (I can literally hear grinding type sounds when I change gears and feel the vibration as well).

 

Question - did the valet screw up my clutch? Or could my clutch have reached the end of its useful life coincidentally? i.e. my car is 13 years old with 105k miles on it and I don't know when the last owner changed the clutch

 

Thanks!

 

The unfortunate answer is "Yes".  Before pulling the car apart, however, I would flush the clutch hydraulics, just to make sure the problem is not that the valet got the clutch hot and cause a moisture induced bubble in the hydraulic system.  If that does not work, you are in for a clutch job; an excellent time to update the RMS, IMS, and AOS while the car is apart.  And then stop using valet parking :eek:

[Silver_TT]

Agree.  When the clutch went out on my previous 996 C4S it basically just all of a sudden happened one day without any kind of warning.  I noticed the pedal felt different and the point of engagement was different.  It turned out to be an issue with the pressure plate, rest of the clutch was fine but I had about 50K miles on it so I just replaced it while they were in there.... I would not continue to drive it until you have it repaired to eliminate the possibility of doing even more damage.  Even if the valet did somehow cause it, I don't think you would be able to prove it so, as already stated, the best thing to do is not to use them anymore when possible.  Good luck, hope it's just the hydraulics since that would save you the cost of dropping the transmission/transaxel.

[Enlai Chu]

Thanks so much, everyone! That was super helpful!!

[Enlai Chu]

By the way, does anyone know of clutches that have not needed replacement for over 100k miles? 150k perhaps?

[Silver_TT]

There's a guy on this site with a 996 TT that says he has 300K on the original clutch.  Does that mean this is normal and should be expected?  No, probably not.  It's really hard to say using mileage as the only indicator.  Take for example someone who drives cross-country on the highway all year long for work.... vs. someone street racing from stop light to stop light.  All that said though, the clutch has a number of moving parts.  So as I said in my case, the clutch was ok but there was an issue with the engagement of the pressure plate.  Sometimes it can be other related parts that need replacement......

Edited August 16, 2015 by Silver_TT

[Loren]

By the way, does anyone know of clutches that have not needed replacement for over 100k miles? 150k perhaps?

 

It is not the clutch design that makes it to 100K miles plus ... it is the driver and how they use it.

If you are doing drag racing starts or downshifting at too high a speed you will increase clutch wear.

 

When I took the engine out of my 1976 911S with over 135,000 miles on it the clutch still looked very good and was just under 50% worn and I did hundreds of autocross and track events in that car.

That was the factory clutch - so as I said it is not the clutch material or design it is how then clutch is used.

[JFP in PA]

By the way, does anyone know of clutches that have not needed replacement for over 100k miles? 150k perhaps?

 

We have multiple customers still on their factory clutches in excess of 150K, and even a handful over 200K.  As Loren noted, it is not the clutch that determines its life expectancy, it is the driver.

[Enlai Chu]

Fantastic. Thanks for the info, everyone. The valet service is saying that my car probably already needed a clutch change at 100k so I wanted to know that there was no particular odo mileage where the clutch needed to be changed.

[Silver_TT]

 

By the way, does anyone know of clutches that have not needed replacement for over 100k miles? 150k perhaps?

 

It is not the clutch design that makes it to 100K miles plus ... it is the driver and how they use it.

If you are doing drag racing starts or downshifting at too high a speed you will increase clutch wear.

 

When I took the engine out of my 1976 911S with over 135,000 miles on it the clutch still looked very good and was just under 50% worn and I did hundreds of autocross and track events in that car.

That was the factory clutch - so as I said it is not the clutch material or design it is how then clutch is used.

 

 

Agree.  This is essentially what I was saying as well.  Wow though, impressive that at 135K after hundreds of track events the clutch was still under 50% -- not surprising except for the tracking of the car.  I would bet that you are much smoother on the clutch than most folks you meet at track events.  When I bought my TT the previous owner had just replaced the entire clutch assembly at 40K miles... it's a different gearbox than the Carrera but just using mileage as an indicator, you will really see numbers all over the board.  I have seen people needing a new clutch after 25K miles.  As these guys said, life of the clutch itself is, for the most part, dependent on the driver.  But just remember it isn't always disc wear that is the problem if your clutch is slipping... it can be something else, like the pressure plate not engaging properly as was the case in my situation.  If that's the case you will have a decision if you want to replace the other parts while you are in there, since the cost of dropping the gearbox alone is a large part of the labor cost of this job.