Coolant Line Repair for a Turbo

[jcam]

The car is an 02 Turbo X-50 and has a coolant hose with fitting that has popped out of a cast metal block located on the right hand side of the engine. This cast metal piece has an aluminum male sleeve fitting that is glued, yes glued into the cast metal block and wherein a rubber coolant hose clamps over the other end of the aluminum male sleeve. Apparently the glue holding these two parts together commonly fails and Porsches fix for this problem is to replace the cast metal fitting with the same part and NOT to re-insert the aluminum sleeve with a more permanent solution, such as JB Welding, common welding or brazing. While I normally would not have an issue paying the cash to replace a part with a new one that fixes the original design problem, in this case, if the car were repaired by Porsche standards, I would only be replacing a broken part with one that will soon be broken. My mechanic has been ignoring Porsches recommended fix for some time and has been JB Welding the two parts back together. However, in this case the problem is access and in order to either replace the part per Porsche or JB Weld it back together, the engine has to be dropped and the upper portion of the engine removed just to get to the part. This involves about $2,500 of work to fix a $10 problem. Since this appears to be a common problem, does anyone know of another way of sliding the male fitting back into the cast metal block without dropping the engine?

Your input is appreciated.

Edited September 5, 2011 by jcam

[Sunnyside]

subscribed to thread.

[Loren]

The folks at Sharwerks made a threaded bolt though both pieces and then glued and Locite'd the bolt to keep things in place.

Others have choose to take the parts out and have them TIG welded - somewhat hard as you really have to clean the pieces.

[JFP in PA]

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't this issue recently written up in Excellence magazine? If it is, they came up with a welding solution that is supposed to be a permanent fix............

[jcam]

The folks at Sharwerks made a threaded bolt though both pieces and then glued and Locite'd the bolt to keep things in place.

Others have choose to take the parts out and have them TIG welded - somewhat hard as you really have to clean the pieces.

Thanks Loren,

The fix itself isn't a problem, I trust my Mechanic's solution in that JB Welding will get the job done. I was wondering if anyone has figured out how to get around the issue of access to the part and was able to snake the fitting back into the casting without having to drop and dismantle the engine? One of the castings is easier to get to and only requires removal of the alternator. The casting in question requires about 15-20 hours of labor to get to.

[Silver_TT]

Sorry to revive an old thread but, jcam, did you end up having the welding done? I'm faced with the same decision now and am looking for guidance from someone that's already been down this road..........thanks in advance

[JFP in PA]

The folks at Sharwerks made a threaded bolt though both pieces and then glued and Locite'd the bolt to keep things in place.Others have choose to take the parts out and have them TIG welded - somewhat hard as you really have to clean the pieces.

Thanks Loren,The fix itself isn't a problem, I trust my Mechanic's solution in that JB Welding will get the job done. I was wondering if anyone has figured out how to get around the issue of access to the part and was able to snake the fitting back into the casting without having to drop and dismantle the engine? One of the castings is easier to get to and only requires removal of the alternator. The casting in question requires about 15-20 hours of labor to get to.

Because of the number of fittings, and the level of pain to get at them with the engine in the car (if you can), the better approach has been to drop the engine out and do it on a stand. Overall, takes less time, and everything is pretty much out in the open.

[jpflip]

I did it. It is not an easy job but can be done. It give me the opportunity to fix lots of other things like sense line shafing and damaged wiring + learn a lot about my car. The most difficult part was to found the proper welder to do the job.....

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/996-turbo-gt2/267584-coolant-pipe-repair-parts-needed.html

[Silver_TT]

jpflip, thanks for chiming in. I've read a lot of your posts and you have a lot of good knowledge about the Turbo. I was wondering a few things:

1. how much you paid to have the job done?
2. Is there anything else that should be done at the same time presumably while the engine's out?
3. Where did you buy the fittings for the 8 pipes that have to be welded (from your 6speed post)? How much were the parts?
4. Is all the information in your 6speed post the complete list of information I would need to give my mechanic to have this job done properly. He hasn't done this specific job before but they do all kinds of crazy stuff and build racecars so if he tells me he can do it, I believe him. The guy's a rockstar.

Thanks

[jpflip]

jpflip, thanks for chiming in. I've read a lot of your posts and you have a lot of good knowledge about the Turbo. I was wondering a few things:

1. how much you paid to have the job done?
2. Is there anything else that should be done at the same time presumably while the engine's out?
3. Where did you buy the fittings for the 8 pipes that have to be welded (from your 6speed post)? How much were the parts?
4. Is all the information in your 6speed post the complete list of information I would need to give my mechanic to have this job done properly. He hasn't done this specific job before but they do all kinds of crazy stuff and build racecars so if he tells me he can do it, I believe him. The guy's a rockstar.

Thanks

Pleasure to help you ferrugia. to answer some of your questions

1: I've paid only for the welding job and was charge $125.00 + around $400.00 for parts (not including the water pump and thermostat housing that I broke). I know some other have paid over $400.00 to get it done. For the complete job done in a shop I saw prices from $2500.00 to $5000.00. Of course I am not including other problem found like water pump damaged etc....

2: Depend of you if you would like new diverter valves, new clutch, GT2 conversion, but I am recommending coolant rubber pipes replacement especially the ones impossible or difficult to reach with the engine in place.

3: Bought all 6 fittings on Ebay from a seller that is not there anymore but there are other seller out there and one on Ebay is selling 8 fittings for $199.00 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-GT1-Engine-Coolant-water-pipe-fitting-repair-kit-weld-in-/310431977816?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4847301158&vxp=mtr

4: You got a lot of information on my post. I would say a lot more than you need. Especially if you don't want to replace all the o-rings, rubber hose etc. I have to be honest with you many looks really good but I did not took a chance. There is no mention of torque used for bolts and screws of different components. Like engine carrier or axle etc. Some torques are in the repair manual page 1182. You should give them a print or better the complete engine removal and installation section. I don't see why a good mechanic that got experience would not be able to do the job. If you thrust them go for it!

Edited March 17, 2013 by jpflip

[jpflip]

Just did a little exercise . You got all the part# (updated may last year) that I've order + prices I've paid (Sonnen). Of course may be you don't need all of those but it can help locate the ones needed and give you an idea of what's the cost. Sorry if I forgot any but did my best to help. The total is $335.17 including all the rubber hoses. Of course that is in the better world. I had to include 4 oil lines for the turbos that were seized on the water pump housing, a water pump because one impeller was broken, thermostat housing because I dropped it by accident and also I've replaced all the hose clips and clamps ...

999 707 410 40 o-ring coolant temperature sensor housing+ 3 other coolant pipe housing 4 $2.75 ($11.00)

999 707 411 40 water pipe housing 8 $4.14 ($33.12)

996 106 214 70 protective ring 4 $5.13 ($20.52)

999 707 505 40 fuel black o-ring line 1 $4.14

999 707 506 40 fuel beige o-ring line 1 $8.27

999 707 364 41 oil reservoir check valve o-ring 1 $ $1.38

996 106 340 71 water pump gasket 1 $7.46

996 106 326 71 thermostat gasket 1 $2.48

999 707 315 40 water pump housing o-ring 1 $1.38

999 707 468 40 water pump housing o-ring 1 $4.14

900 123 144 30 coolant drain port seal 2 $1.04 ($2.08)

999 701 789 40 oil cooler housing + oil lines to turbo o-ring 8 $0.57 ($4.56)

999 707 422 41 o-ring oil filter bracket 1 $4.14

999 707 426 41 o-ring oil filter bracket insert 1 $4.14

999 707 113 41 oil cooler bracket insert o-ring 1 $2.75

999 701 789 40 oil cooler bracket oil line 1 $1.75

999 707 446 40 oil cooler bracket oil line o-ring 1 $1.38

999 707 409 40 oil cooler o-ring 4 $1.38 ($5.40)

996 107 217 70 oil filter housing gasket 1 $3.74

999 707 298 40 sterling pump housing o-ring 1 $2.75

999 707 204 40 o-ring steering reservoir 1 $5.49

996-106-328-74 coolant hose 1 $27.46

996-106-477-75 water hose supply 1 $17.92

996-106-529-73 coolant hose 1 $6.39

996-106-512-74 water hose 1 $15.64

996-106-250-74 water pump hose 1 $10.34

996-106-233-74 water hose 1 $10.08

997-106-502-00 collant hose 1 $23.88

996-106-501-77 collant hose 1 $24.95

996 106 801 03 o-ring 4 $3.21 ($12.84)

996 106 318 02 throttle gasket : 1 $4.94

996 111 217 70 exhaust ring 2 $23.56 ($47.12)

900 123 152 30 o-ring 2 $0.77 ($1.54)

Edited March 17, 2013 by jpflip

[Silver_TT]

Wow, thanks man! I'm still trying to understand and absorb all of this but I can't tell you how incredibly helpful this is!

[jpflip]

Welcome. If you got any questions post them here and "we" will try to answer them asap... :renntech:

Edited March 17, 2013 by jpflip