997 Carrera Manual problems starting - cranking

[RFM]

You have to replace the cable start motor-alternator-connection (on the gearbox) in first place, the rubber cable cap is melted on the start motor solenoid connector. It's a common problem on 997/1.

[Joel Pirela]

It sounds like a poor connection to the starter, not that the battery can't get charged fast enough via the alternator. You need to take the alternator out of the equation and focus on the starter. poor ground, corroded positive cables to the starter may be the culprit as the starters get really hot because of the placement and electrical components hates heat.

[PAULSPEED]

I would say it is the alternator cable. You

can measure the voltage near the alternator.

Hammer a pin like you get when you but a new

shirt into the red cable near the alternator.

Then measure the voltage to ground. If you see

a very small drop compared with reading off

the battery, then it is your cable.

Paul

The little box should be located on the passenger side of the transmission. It is a plastic black box (maybe 2 inches long) that you have to open to see the cables, as on picture.

My issue is that apparently my charging system is not working properly. I was hoping that it was just a manner of cleaning the connections. But apparently it is more than that since it was fairly clean and I still have the same problem.

As for location, you have to remove the first under carriage cover (over the rear axle) and you should be able to see mounted to the passenger side of the transmission. This could solve your problem…but did not solve mine.

My problem is that my battery is not getting charged fast enough after starting the car…therefore, if my car does not rest (or run for a while) before stopping it will not start again. The battery does not have enough juice to start. Battery was replaced but it is not the problem.

Paul, do you know if replacing the voltage regulator on the alternator could potentially solve the problem?

Regards,

[leocanto]

Last week I took the car to the mechanic and after running all of the diagnostics he found that the cable was the problem. Total bill was $730 (cable $130) + labor + diagnostics, etc...

Car is running like new!!!

[PAULSPEED]

Let's hope that he put in the 997-2 cable. It is fatter

then the 997-1 cable. Sounds like a normal price

for this type of work.

Should of taken about three hours. Sure is not an easy job.

Paul

[mghorayeb]

I have a manual 2006 997 S, and have the same problem. The car always starts, but sometimes struggles to do so, especially after I've driven it hard...

The dealer here (in Dubai) told me it's a "wiring harness" (sounds like this matches the cases above), and that though the cable is cheap, the labour is not. He mentioned removing the dash (which now sounds like a crock - is this correct?). Anyhow, the part was ca. $200, and labour ca. $750, so this is in line with the quotes above.

Also, the passenger airbag light has come on and dealer says this is directly related...

1. Shall I just keep driving the car AS IS, and wait for it to fail completely? or

2. Shall I get the temporary sanding/cleaning fix done (by a non-dealer)? or

3. Should I suck it up and just have it done at the dealer?

I've driven ca. 50 911s ranging from late 70s to recent, and this is my favourite, a real driver's car (sports exhaust, sports seats, sports shifter, and sports wheels).

Thanks in advance for any pointers.

Mark, Dubai.

[acao]

I had this problem for 3 years. It came to a head a few months ago when I was stranded twice in one day, need a good samaritan jump each time. Get it fixed. The dealer fixed mine for around $1000 and said the cable was pretty toasted. It's not alot of money compared to the possibility of being stranded somewhere without notice. Do you work? Have planes to catch? Does your family rely on you to pick up dinner on the way home? Do you drive with clients? See patients or go to court? Once you get it fixed, you'll be amazed at the peace of mind that comes with taking for granted that your car will start every time.

[mxt_77]

Score another one for the alternator-to-starter cable. Dealer replaced mine today (under warranty), and now she starts like a champ!

[0356kid]

Mxt 77

What year is your car and how many miles?

[mxt_77]

It's an '08. I bought it used with 34K miles on it and it was already exhibiting the symptoms. Based on service records, the battery had been replaced about 3-5K miles before I bought it, so I suspect they were trying to remedy the same problem... with no success. So, I'm guessing it had been ongoing for a while.

[PAULSPEED]

Looks very clean.

Guess you need to upgrade to the 997-2

cable.

You will thank me when it is done.

Paul

[csman]

Had similar problem with '05 997 C2S particularly when hot. Tried cleaning up the cable connection under the car but this didn't cure it. Porsche sent me down the alternator route (£££ or $$$$ depending which side of the Atlantic you are on), still no fix. Turned out to be new starter motor which gave me 100% cure for over a year before I sold the car. Horrible not to be 100% sure that you car is going to start.

[PAULSPEED]

Now that looks clean!!!

Good luck.

Paul

[mghorayeb]

Update: I took my 911 into the dealer to get this fixed the other day. They replaced the loom cable with the newer/upgraded 997.2 type part (997-607-019-03), and found that the issue was not solved. They removed that new cable (fearing it could get damaged), set it aside for me, and have ordered me the 2nd potential culprit cable (battery harness 997-612-090-02). It will be a few days before that part arrives and I get the 2 installed...so I'll have to wait to see if that takes care of things. Hopefully I don't have an alternator/starter, or battery issue too...Either way, the car has yet to leave me stranded, is a joy to drive every day, even for a 6'2" 250lber with a bad knee.

I'll write again after the next visit to the dealer.

In the meantime, drive safe, happy holidays, and bless the US!

[RFM]

If there is driven too long with the cable which has a too high resistance, you may be sure that the starter motor is damaged by too much heat.

[jgarg2005]

Just received the diagnosis from the dealer that my starter harness cable needs to be replaced due to slow hot cranking and 1V drop. Now here's the bad part: for a tiptronic they want $2,700 to replace since it requires the engine and transmission to come out? Can that be true???

[mghorayeb]

I am taking my car back in today (they now have both cables in stock). When there I will ask them regarding this job on a tiptronic - your dealer sounds expensive regardless. The beauty of the 911 is even if the engine/transmission need to come out, this is comparatively easy. I have helped in the pits trackside, and seen a transmission replaced (necessitating an engine/transmission replacement) in 20 minutes. Granted that this was a race car and a pit crew, but $2K for labour represents what seems like lots of hours. If your car is out of warranty, call a few other dealers in the area and see what they quote. Also, it may be wise to replace both cables (they are the cheap part of the repair) and ascertain that your starter is strong too.

I will know the outcome of my repair (2 cable replacement) in a week (I'll be traveling for work), so will update later.

In the meantime, best of luck to you.

[RFM]

There is no need to remove the engine, not even lowering on a Tiptronic. It takes more time and is harder to do due a lack of room around the gearbox area, but it is still doable.

[jgarg2005]

Thanks for the feedback. I called around to several other dealers in the area and they quoted significantly less. The lowest quote I got from a dealer was $1080. So I called my dealer back and he agreed to match the price without hesitation! Dropped $1,600 instantly!

[mghorayeb]

Justification for you to become a contributing member...

Please update us on what exactly was replaced/repaired, how the car runs after the repair (comparing before/after) and how much they charged...

[PAULSPEED]

I was told by a mechanic that you lift the car and with a long rod,

you hammer underneath the transmission to pop the alternator cable loose from

the top of the transmission. There is not much working room and it does take

a good hit to pop loose.

There is no way to get your hands into the top of the transmission because

the transmission cooler sits on top of the transmission and it is in the way.

Paul

[phillipj]

Thanks for the feedback. I called around to several other dealers in the area and they quoted significantly less. The lowest quote I got from a dealer was $1080. So I called my dealer back and he agreed to match the price without hesitation! Dropped $1,600 instantly!

You have to love dealers. They just hope that you're stupid enough....

[mghorayeb]

Update: Just got car back after both cables replaced - parts and labour came close to $1K. Car sounds normal when it starts, not sluggish when firing up. Was told that starter is fine. Will keep an eye on it, and update if/when necessary. Hope this is the end of this saga...

[lawt]

I had exactly the same problem on my 06 C2S and managed to fix it. The above posts are correct, there is a fault in the heavy gauge B+ cable on the engine that feeds power to the starter - the fault is a poor crimp on the lug that bolts to the starter itself. This was a known fault for 05/06 cars and the approved fix is a new cable at great expense as the cable sits under the rest of the engine loom so is very difficult to access to replace. I repaired mine in situ which took about 1 hr. I bought a 35 quid hydraulic crimp tool off ebay and pulled out the air box, the throttle body and plenum. I could then remove the B+ cable end off the starter (battery disconnected) and pull it out towards the rear of the car sufficiently to get the crimp tool on. With the very powerful hydraulic tool the crimp was re-shaped and re-secured to the cable. All back together an perfect, cranks perfectly all the time, hot or cold.

[mghorayeb]

Update: Though there was an improvement after the cables were replaced, I was never happy with the way the car started (it always sounded tired, especially when warm)...until I eventually ended up stuck. After some funky theatrics like lights flashing, windows creeping up/down incrementally etc., I called my trusty mechanic who suggested I get it jumped and get battery replaced. Long story short, I went with a Bosch Silver battery, 80 amps (the previous one was 70), and the car has been starting the way I always expected/wanted it to. The Bosch installed cost me about $150, vs. Porsche that wanted an insane $400. Though I always opt to go to the local dealer who is pretty reasonable in general, I am presently unemployed, and have never been stupid with $, so Bosch it was...and I'm perfectly happy.