Slow turnover on 997CS 2005

[csman]

I have a problem and need some help before I am relieved of any more cash :(

I have a 2005 Carrera S (coupe, manual) with near 40k miles on the clock. Since I have had the car (18 months) i have had a problem with hot starting. Basically after a run or sitting in traffic when I stop the engine and restart after a short time, (fuel stop, brief stop to put it in the garage), the starter turns over very slowly almost to the point when you think it will stop.

Most times it picks up again and the engine fires cleanly but it has let me down once and failed to start. After an hour or so when I returned with jump leads assuming a flat battery it fired (just) without me using them. Porsche center advised that I needed new battery then a new alternator, both of which had little or no effect after lots of cash. The car is kept in the garage with a Porsche battery conditioner plugged in so the battery is in top nick. Also, if left for 2 weeks without the battery conditioner plugged in it still fire quickly and cleanly indicating charging and battery are fine.

Any ideas what I should do before it leaves me stranded somewhere?

Cheers

CS man

Edited February 22, 2009 by csman

[Loren]

1. Get your battery load tested.

Most batteries only last 4 years - so if that is the original you should replace it.

2. Once the battery is know to be good measure the voltage at the battery with the engine running - it should be around 13-14 volts.

[wvicary]

If the battery test fine then you need to check the ground paths and also the starter draw after it has been heat soaked.

[bmohr]

sounds like you need a new starter motor. I had similar hard to crank/weak crank on hot starts when i first bought my car and replaced the starter motor which solved all my issues. Of course i verified the bat was good by testing it first. There is a starter motor diy here you can work through, just be patient and watch out for brittle plastic and hoses! lol

[csman]

sounds like you need a new starter motor. I had similar hard to crank/weak crank on hot starts when i first bought my car and replaced the starter motor which solved all my issues. Of course i verified the bat was good by testing it first. There is a starter motor diy here you can work through, just be patient and watch out for brittle plastic and hoses! lol

Thanks for all of the replies. as I mentioned in the first post, the battery and alternater are brand new from Porsche Centre and tested/charging sucessfully. Where do I find the starter motor DIY?

many thanks

[RFM]

I would check the starter motor head cable also, if the rubber protective cap on the rear of the starter solenoid, is melted on the cable by heat, replace the cable. 997 is well known for bad starter cables, too much resistance in power supply to the starter and battery.

[csman]

I would check the starter motor head cable also, if the rubber protective cap on the rear of the starter solenoid, is melted on the cable by heat, replace the cable. 997 is well known for bad starter cables, too much resistance in power supply to the starter and battery.

Thanks RFM, still cant find the DIY section mentioned earlier that would point me in the right direction to diagnose/swap out the starter and or cables?

[Nickinohio]

I would check the starter motor head cable also, if the rubber protective cap on the rear of the starter solenoid, is melted on the cable by heat, replace the cable. 997 is well known for bad starter cables, too much resistance in power supply to the starter and battery.

Thanks RFM, still cant find the DIY section mentioned earlier that would point me in the right direction to diagnose/swap out the starter and or cables?

Hi csman. I just bought my first 997 yesterday, and I had similar problems. I flew across the states to pick it up at the dealer, and then I had a 9 hour drive ahead of me. The car started fine at the dealer, but started cranking much slower at the rest stops. By the time I got home, it wouldn't start at all! I just Googled this link, and it looks like the long explanation may have some merit. What do you think? Mine is still under warranty for a month, so I am heading straight to the dealer. Let me know what you come up with.

http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?p=436230

Nick

[csman]

I would check the starter motor head cable also, if the rubber protective cap on the rear of the starter solenoid, is melted on the cable by heat, replace the cable. 997 is well known for bad starter cables, too much resistance in power supply to the starter and battery.

Thanks RFM, still cant find the DIY section mentioned earlier that would point me in the right direction to diagnose/swap out the starter and or cables?

Hi csman. I just bought my first 997 yesterday, and I had similar problems. I flew across the states to pick it up at the dealer, and then I had a 9 hour drive ahead of me. The car started fine at the dealer, but started cranking much slower at the rest stops. By the time I got home, it wouldn't start at all! I just Googled this link, and it looks like the long explanation may have some merit. What do you think? Mine is still under warranty for a month, so I am heading straight to the dealer. Let me know what you come up with.

http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?p=436230

Nick

Hi Nick, thanks for this. it sound like a good explanation. The thread has a slightly different sypmtom to mine (and I think yours) because with mine the starter always turns but very slowly (i.e not just a click). In saying that the fix could be the same (i.e. corroded cable). My car had a tough early life being used year round on wet salty British motorwarys/highways so corrosion could be high on the list of causes. The symptoms that you descibe seem very similary to mine assuming you battery and charging circuit are working well.

I could do with some pictures/diagrams of what cable to inspect and how to replace the starter, but haven't found any yet. The car is out of warranty hence trying to investigate the diy route before getting stung by the dealer again!

I will let you know if I make progress and would be interested in the diagnosis from your dealer.

Cheers

csman

[PAULSPEED]

Here is a simple fix. There is a wire that runs from the alternator to a low

spot next to the transmission on the passenger side.

1. You disconnect the battery.

2. You jack up the passenger side and add jack stands.

3. Next, you crawl under the car and you will seee the wire running down

from the top of the transmission to a little plastic door.

4. You open the door and remove the nut holding the wire.

5. You then sand the plate and the end of the wire and bolt

it back together.

It sems like this connection picks up alot of road stuff and

cleaning this spot should help alot.

Paul

[csman]

Here is a simple fix. There is a wire that runs from the alternator to a low

spot next to the transmission on the passenger side.

1. You disconnect the battery.

2. You jack up the passenger side and add jack stands.

3. Next, you crawl under the car and you will seee the wire running down

from the top of the transmission to a little plastic door.

4. You open the door and remove the nut holding the wire.

5. You then sand the plate and the end of the wire and bolt

it back together.

It sems like this connection picks up alot of road stuff and

cleaning this spot should help alot.

Paul

Thanks Paul,

Thats the kind of stuff I was looking for. I will have some time to do this in 2 weeks and will let you know whether it is successful.

Many thanks

csman

[Nickinohio]

Here is a simple fix. There is a wire that runs from the alternator to a low

spot next to the transmission on the passenger side.

1. You disconnect the battery.

2. You jack up the passenger side and add jack stands.

3. Next, you crawl under the car and you will seee the wire running down

from the top of the transmission to a little plastic door.

4. You open the door and remove the nut holding the wire.

5. You then sand the plate and the end of the wire and bolt

it back together.

It sems like this connection picks up alot of road stuff and

cleaning this spot should help alot.

Paul

Thanks Paul,

Thats the kind of stuff I was looking for. I will have some time to do this in 2 weeks and will let you know whether it is successful.

Many thanks

csman

Keep us posted. I will have the dealer check this spot....if they don't diagnose it first! I am really interested in their diagnosis. I am also taking the car to an independent shop on Friday, so I will ask them for an opinion as well. I will keep you posted.

Nick

[csman]

Here is a simple fix. There is a wire that runs from the alternator to a low

spot next to the transmission on the passenger side.

1. You disconnect the battery.

2. You jack up the passenger side and add jack stands.

3. Next, you crawl under the car and you will seee the wire running down

from the top of the transmission to a little plastic door.

4. You open the door and remove the nut holding the wire.

5. You then sand the plate and the end of the wire and bolt

it back together.

It sems like this connection picks up alot of road stuff and

cleaning this spot should help alot.

Paul

Hi Paul, I am having difficulty locating both the wire and therfore flap. Could you indicate where the cable / flap is on the attached picture of a model 997 GT3 (which is remarkably accurate and similar to my c2s underside!). I can only find one flap which I have shown on the photo and there is no cable behind it. should I be looking more in toward the rear of the car in the open section with no undertray?

many thanks

csman

Edited March 17, 2009 by csman

[csman]

Keep us posted. I will have the dealer check this spot....if they don't diagnose it first! I am really interested in their diagnosis. I am also taking the car to an independent shop on Friday, so I will ask them for an opinion as well. I will keep you posted.

Nick

Hi Nick, awaiting feedback from Paul above but did your independent offer any advice on the possible cause?

thanks

csman

[PAULSPEED]

My car does not have half that many plastic plates. Here is

a picture where you can find it.

Paul

[PAULSPEED]

Here it is on your GT-3 model.

Paul

[csman]

Here it is on your GT-3 model.

Paul

Hi Paul, thanks for the pics. These helped me to find the connection quite easily. The big difference is that, as you mentioned my UK supplied car seems to have many more under-body panels than your car (wet UK climate perhaps). Looking at the picture I had to remove the whole triangular rear section plus some of the panel further forward to get access to the cable under another flap! Also the cable is in the right hand side of the car for both left hand drive and right hand drive cars.

Anyway, good news is that I have done it, there was some corrosion on the connection which has now been removed, treated with some moisture repellent spray (WD40) and reassembled. :rolleyes:

The great news is that initial impression is that the issue is fixed for £0 ($0)! :D Repeated hot starts have all been successfully with no sign of the starter slowing down. I withhold final judgment for a week or so of normal driving / use but initial impressions are excellent. Thanks again for you help on this as it may well have saved me a small fortune in workshop fees as well as an embarrassing breakdown.

Thanks

CSM

:renntech:

[PAULSPEED]

I was at the dealer the other day to get a free Tech inspection

befor the nest (3/28/09) track event. The bigger size alternator

cable for the 997-2 was very easy to buy. Installing it on

a 997S with tip is Extremely hard to do. The dealer would

want about $1,100 for this job.

The secret is to have a long rod and have the car on a lift. The

bracket to break is behingd the intercooler and the only way to get

to it is drop the motor or use a long rod and a hammer.

I almost debated on leaving the existing one and adding the bigger one

but now it seems dump.

Paul

[PAULSPEED]

I sure would like to get more plates. My go-kart went faster

with a bottom plate. Wounder how much different the plates are

with the UK versus USA model.

Looks like I need some plates.

Paul

[Jdw997]

Hi guys,

Living in Dubai, got a lots of problems with the starter, when engine hot. Unable to start so first check battery and 1 cell faulty. Installed new battery but problem reoccured after about 1 month. So suspected starter problem. the change procedure is the same as on a 996. found the insulation of the wire conected to the starter melted. so pulled out the starter and just tested it on a battery but starter with no load on still not spinning freely, also wire(500amps cap) got hot in les than 10 sec. So I exchange the starter and also the cable from the starter to the connection on the gearbox. quite easy job. A friend with the dealership told me that the link of the starter cable to the alternator cable is to weak on the 997 so a new, stronger version is now available, which I can confirm.

997S starts now with no problem (already 37deg c outside temp). ah costs of it all, exhange starter 350 euros + cable 70 euros.