starter is running too long

[muggs]

well, after over 141k miles, the starter is beginning to run about a second after the engine fires up. does this mean i will need a new starter?? if so how much labor will be needed to replace it? sunset porshe has a"reasonable" price for a new one. btw i have a 98 met black with beige interior that i have had for 10 years and one month.

[RFM]

If you mean that the starter makes an " elephant noise " like some forum members call, when the engine is fired up and you leave the key then you got a starter problem. The labour depends on the mechanic experience and is approx. 1 hour.

[rsfeller]

This is a common issue with our cars (and many Vw I have had too including a eurovan and GTI 1.8T) and most learn to live with it. I do not believe the starter is running long but that the gear engagement system is not releasing as quick due to old grease or a worn part. Someone can clarify me on the terms used to describe the internal workings of a starter, I'm rather rusty since my last change of a starter.

Just live with it unless you got money to spend. Mind has been doing it for two years w/o any noticeable different in starting capabilities. It does it more when the car sits in the garage but when I'm driving daily it only does it first start of the day. That is why I lean toward the lubricant/grease theory.

If I get the car on a lift again this summer I may pull it out and inspect the system for signs for cause and/or failure.

This is my opinion of the so called "sick elephant" noise.

Edited June 15, 2008 by rsfeller

[JFP in PA]

The issue is a failing Bendix drive unit on the starter that is not retracting fully or in a timely fashion. While the Bendix unit can be serviced or replaced, most just replace the entire starter. Remanufactured OEM unit will be in the $220-300 range with a core exchange.

[juniinc]

The electrical section of the armature that contacts the brushes sometimes wear out . Worn bearings, especially in the tailshaft. The heat generated in the starter by the engine and the exhaust pipes causes the armature to expand. If the bearings are worn then the armature drags (actually contacts) on the stator causing a short circuit and a high friction drag.

I usually take it to my starter guy, charges me about $80

[rsfeller]

My bet is on the failed Bendix for the odd sound!

JUNIINC, does your failure item perstain to the "run on sound" too?

[juniinc]

90% of failures that I've seen in the past were caused by a faulty solenoid, so they usually stop running,,, click,click USUALLY the first indication of a faulty bendix is when you start the engine, the starter spins with no load (not engaging). Usually bendix spring or retainer washer on the end has broken.

But who cares? just replace it w/ either new or rebuilt.

Edited June 15, 2008 by juniinc

[rsfeller]

I too have seen many solenoid failures on Vw's but I believe the bendix is what we are discussing here that makes that crazy sound. I don't think I experienced the odd sound with solenoid failure other then the starter run on from lack of engagement.

[juniinc]

odd sound with solenoid failure? who said that,,,LOL

Yes armature drag, bendix failure can cause a high friction noise.

Usually a faulty bendix will not even engage the tooth and notice I said USUALLY

I too have seen many solenoid failures on Vw's but I believe the bendix is what we are discussing here that makes that crazy sound. I don't think I experienced the odd sound with solenoid failure other then the starter run on from lack of engagement.

Edited June 15, 2008 by juniinc

[bwillis]

I have the same issue i.e. elephant noise (although I think it's more like a moose!)

I'm ok with not doing anything until it fails completely, but just wanted to make sure that that won't cause damage elsewhere e.g. can this cause the ring gear to come off?

Thanks,

Bob