Clutch DIY vs. Dealer

[george996]

Deciding whether to replace my clutch myself or have dealer do it on my 2004 996 C2 and looking for some input. It’s been a long time since I replaced the clutch in my 911SC so I have some idea about what is involved. I am not comfortable about replacing the RMS myself.

The Porsche dealer will replace the DMF, clutch disc, pressure plate, throw out bearing and RMS, parts, labor and tax for approx. $2,200. This price discounted for another reason. If I were to do the job myself I would probably omit the DMF and my cost would be about $500. The DMF rattles during shutdown so I am not opposed to replacing it (dealer says this is normal and will not cover it).

I would really appreciate some comments. Thank you.

[Izzy]

Doing that work is beyond me, but would ask please, if you do end up doing it, take a lot of pictures and write a DIY. If I lived near you would even offer to help (and learn).

[kbrandsma]

I have a 986 5 speed and I replaced my RMS, IMS, clutch and a few other things this past winter. Your estimated cost of $500 is right on. I purchased a few tools and a transmission jack to get the job done. If you get it down to the flywheel, 8 more bolts and your at the RMS and IMS. I would do it myself again if I had to do it over. If I can help let me know. Good luck and keep us posted.

Edited March 27, 2008 by kbrandsma

[1999Porsche911]

Is there a specific reason you are replacing the DMF? They seldom need replacing unless a spring breaks. Complete clutch kit replacement, including parts can run as low as $1200. (No flywheel)

Edited March 27, 2008 by 1999Porsche911

[george996]

Is there a specific reason you are replacing the DMF? They seldom need replacing unless a spring breaks. Complete clutch kit replacement, including parts can run as low as $1200. (No flywheel)

I am having a dilemma about replacing the DMF. It rattles when shutting down; otherwise there are no other issues with it as far as I know. If the dealer replaces the clutch they insist on replacing the DMF as well. The car is under warranty so the benefit of having the dealer perform the work is that if the DMF is found defective they will eat that cost. They will not replace it under warranty because of the rattling. I drove 5 similar 996’s recently and 4 rattled just like mine. So I am looking $2,200 for everything or $500 for DIY (w/o DMF).

[Loren]

Did you read the TSB for how to check the DMF?

TSB 8/02 1360 Dual Mass Flywheel Check Procedure -- dated 12-13-02

[george996]

Did you read the TSB for how to check the DMF?

TSB 8/02 1360 Dual Mass Flywheel Check Procedure -- dated 12-13-02

yes. The dealer will not perform the test based on the rattle sound alone. They say it is normal and even a new DMF might make the same rattle. Like is mentioend, I noticed the same rattle in a handfull of 996's and 997's recently. I am hoping that while replacing the clutch they will replace the DMF if it faulty according the procedure you referenced. I met with 2 reprensentatives from Porsche, not only thle dealer about this.

[racerken]

Deciding whether to replace my clutch myself or have dealer do it on my 2004 996 C2 and looking for some input. It’s been a long time since I replaced the clutch in my 911SC so I have some idea about what is involved. I am not comfortable about replacing the RMS myself.

The Porsche dealer will replace the DMF, clutch disc, pressure plate, throw out bearing and RMS, parts, labor and tax for approx. $2,200. This price discounted for another reason. If I were to do the job myself I would probably omit the DMF and my cost would be about $500. The DMF rattles during shutdown so I am not opposed to replacing it (dealer says this is normal and will not cover it).

I would really appreciate some comments. Thank you.

Hi George,

I have the same car as you with the same clutch problem. Have you decided on DIY? Has anyone posted a step by step process to replace the clutch? I have the same quote as you, $ 2,000 and the labor time was 8 hours. That's all they would share with me.

Thanks,

Ken

[george996]

Deciding whether to replace my clutch myself or have dealer do it on my 2004 996 C2 and looking for some input. It’s been a long time since I replaced the clutch in my 911SC so I have some idea about what is involved. I am not comfortable about replacing the RMS myself.

The Porsche dealer will replace the DMF, clutch disc, pressure plate, throw out bearing and RMS, parts, labor and tax for approx. $2,200. This price discounted for another reason. If I were to do the job myself I would probably omit the DMF and my cost would be about $500. The DMF rattles during shutdown so I am not opposed to replacing it (dealer says this is normal and will not cover it).

I would really appreciate some comments. Thank you.

Hi George,

I have the same car as you with the same clutch problem. Have you decided on DIY? Has anyone posted a step by step process to replace the clutch? I have the same quote as you, $ 2,000 and the labor time was 8 hours. That's all they would share with me.

Thanks,

Ken

Ken,

I ended up doing the job myself. I replaced the clutch disc, pressure plate and release bearing. The clutch feels great, light pedal effort and smooth. I did not replace the DMF or rear main seal. The DMF still rattles during shut down but otherwise I am pleased with the clutch operation.

If you are planning to use jack stands, like I did, I recommend modifying the jack stands to lock into the holes of the lifting points. I didn’t feel comfortable otherwise. I’ll post some pics to show you what I did.

Take a look at this link for some pointers http://www.c-speedracing.com/howto/996rms/rms1.php

I also subscribe to Alldata http://www.alldatadiy.com/ where I got all the procedures, specifications, etc.

Besides standard hand tools you will need a transmission jack, floor jack to hold the engine, triple square socket driver for (I can give you the size later) for one of the bolts on the bell housing and a clutch alignment tool.

PM me if you have any questions.

Good luck

George

[kbrandsma]

The triple square bolt is 10mm.

[racerken]

Hey guys,

Thanks for all the details. The C-speed website has plenty of detail.

WRT to the parts, it appears that the DMF costs $900! I'm assuming that it is impossible to resurface without disassembling the entire unit...

First I have to clean out my garage with the old car (see attached), then I have to buy all the necessary parts and tools. I have one question on tools -

Besides a clutch alignment tool and this 3 sq x 10mm bit, could you recommend some tool such as a flywheel wrench? I used to have a snap-on tool that hooked onto the flywheel gears back in high school.

Thanks,

Ken

PS: Is anyone going to the Canadian GP?

[flyingpenguin]

The triple square bolt is 10mm.

I am looking to do a clutch job on my 2000 996 C2 and it seems like kbrandsma knows what he's doing.

I have two concerns:

- Without a lift, how high of a clearance would you need to do this job on jack stands?

- The special 3 square 10 mm bolt. Which one is it? Can you indicate it on the attached picture of the G36 transmission?

Thanks, Joost

Edited May 3, 2008 by Loren
made image viewable

[george996]

The triple square bolt is 10mm.

I am looking to do a clutch job on my 2000 996 C2 and it seems like kbrandsma knows what he's doing.

I have two concerns:

- Without a lift, how high of a clearance would you need to do this job on jack stands?

- The special 3 square 10 mm bolt. Which one is it? Can you indicate it on the attached picture of the G36 transmission?

Thanks, Joost

the triple square is no. 4.

The jack stands were about 16.25 inches. See attached photo of the jack stand mod.

[kbrandsma]

The higher the better. I did mine with half the distance george996 suggests. Also #5 is removed from the front of the car, just the opposite of the other seven. I removed number 1 from up above. To get to #1, I removed the tube from the air filter to the TB and that made #1 very accessible and easy to remove.

I purchased the 10mm trible square from Autozone, brand name OEM. It comes with a set of three, 10mm, 12mm, and 14mm. I took the 10mm to a local muffler shop and they cut it in half to get it down to a length that would fit. The space is tight around the 10mm triplesquare bolt. SOme people permanently weld a wrench to gain the leverage needed.

Good luck!

[flyingpenguin]

Thanks george996 and kbrandsma for your comments. The new flywheel is in and the car runs perfect. I am very happy with the result and would do it again in a heartbeat, although it took me considerably more time than expected. All in all about 10-12 hours, but it was a good learing experience.

Because of your concerns about jackstands I bought a set of 4 double locking 12 ton (!) stands at Northern Tool, as well as their 1.5 ton transmission jack. Once I got the car about 2ft in the air, working underneath the car was a breeze. Getting the transmission jack underneath the transmission and getting it to lift in such a way that the transmission slides off easily was tricky. I recommend attaching it as far away from the bell housing as possible (ie. towards the front of the car) and use the jack's swiveling action to maneuver it around.

If you take the passenger side rear wheel off, you can get to bolt #1 with a 16mm ratcheting box wrench. Like one of the many neighbors that came by this weekend commented, it's like milking a mouse :lol: , but probably quicker than removing the throttle body.

While the tranny was out I took the opportunity to replace the transmission oil as well, so no worries on that one for the next 30K miles or so.

Sorry I did not take any pictures. Maybe next time.

Joost

[kbrandsma]

Congratulations. Sounds like everything is back together.

NICE JOB!

[george996]

Thanks george996 and kbrandsma for your comments. The new flywheel is in and the car runs perfect. I am very happy with the result and would do it again in a heartbeat, although it took me considerably more time than expected. All in all about 10-12 hours, but it was a good learing experience.

Because of your concerns about jackstands I bought a set of 4 double locking 12 ton (!) stands at Northern Tool, as well as their 1.5 ton transmission jack. Once I got the car about 2ft in the air, working underneath the car was a breeze. Getting the transmission jack underneath the transmission and getting it to lift in such a way that the transmission slides off easily was tricky. I recommend attaching it as far away from the bell housing as possible (ie. towards the front of the car) and use the jack's swiveling action to maneuver it around.

If you take the passenger side rear wheel off, you can get to bolt #1 with a 16mm ratcheting box wrench. Like one of the many neighbors that came by this weekend commented, it's like milking a mouse :lol: , but probably quicker than removing the throttle body.

While the tranny was out I took the opportunity to replace the transmission oil as well, so no worries on that one for the next 30K miles or so.

Sorry I did not take any pictures. Maybe next time.

Joost

Congratulations. Glad I was able to help.

[flyingpenguin]

A quick update here.

As I am running the stock unsprung clutch disk on a single mass (light weight) flywheel) I was getting a lot of gear clatter (pulses from the crank shaft transfer thru to the gear box). I don't mind a bit of noise at neutral idle, but all the way up to 3-3,500 rpms the clatter was driving me nuts. Transmission sounded like a coffee grinder, especially at low rpm / high torque! I am convinced that the noise is not damaging the tranny, but nonetheless went looking for a solution.

I got rid of about 80% of the clatter by replacing the tranny oil with Redline Superlight Shockproof gear oil. Great stuff! I figure I might even get rid of another 10-15% of the clatter by using the slightly heavier Redline Light Shockproof gear oil.

Joost

Edited May 20, 2008 by jperquin

[1999Porsche911]

A quick update here.

As I am running the stock unsprung clutch disk on a single mass (light weight) flywheel) I was getting a lot of gear clatter (pulses from the crank shaft transfer thru to the gear box). I don't mind a bit of noise at neutral idle, but all the way up to 3-3,500 rpms the clatter was driving me nuts. Transmission sounded like a coffee grinder, especially at low rpm / high torque! I am convinced that the noise is not damaging the tranny, but nonetheless went looking for a solution.

I got rid of about 80% of the clatter by replacing the tranny oil with Redline Superlight Shockproof gear oil. Great stuff! I figure I might even get rid of another 10-15% of the clatter by using the slightly heavier Redline Light Shockproof gear oil.

Joost

Not a good decision to run with an unsprung setup. Be prepared for some expensive repairs if you dive the car hard. You crank pluses are simply warning you of what is ahead. Biggest risk is at low engine speed and heavy load during engagement. Good luck.

Edited May 20, 2008 by 1999Porsche911