'08 Cayenne Turbo Brakes

[Moose-LandTran]

Hi all,

I have a 2008 Cayenne Turbo in my shop, which has the high performance brakes fitted. we're doing (or supposed to be) the brake pads all round, the only problem is the bolts used on the calipers. they're like aerospace-type spline bolts, except they have 10 splines instead of 12. we don't have a tool for this, nor have we ever seen these kind of bolts before. there are two sizes, on about 12mm that holds the pads in place, and one maybe 16mm that seems to hold the caliper to the hub. i've phoned Porsche about the tool we need, which apparently is available through Snap-on, or at least one of the dealers. however, i've had no luck in locating one. (well, two. i want both sockets needed.)

If anyone could shed some light on this it would be much appreciuated, as i have a car stuck on the ramps and don't want to damage the bolts removing them another way.

i'd like the right tool for the job for future work.

Many Thanks,

Moose.

[Loren]

Hmm... are you sure they aren't triple-square bolts?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_Square_screws

[Cannoli]

Hmm... are you sure they aren't triple-square bolts?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_Square_screws

I agree with Loren ... they are triple square bits, also known as XZN bits. Sure, Snap-On sells them, but can be found by others as well.

Here is a link to AutoDax.com that sells a XZN Bit Set for $28.97 plus S&H.

http://www.autodax.com/catalog/pdetail.php?prdid=44

Good luck.

Edited March 13, 2008 by Cannoli

[Moose-LandTran]

No, they're male bolt head, and they have 10 splines instead of 12. i'll try get a pic later.

[Cannoli]

No, they're male bolt head, and they have 10 splines instead of 12. i'll try get a pic later.

Oh, okay. Yes, a picture will help. The 955 (2003 - 2006 Cayenne) uses the XZN bit. I've seen bolts on high-end multi-piece wheels (HRE, Kinesis, etc.) use a multi-spline male cap.

The 2008 Cayenne Turbo brake calipers - are they manufactured by Ate? They are huge and must weigh a ton! Monsters.

[Moose-LandTran]

Snapped some pics today, hope this helps. still seems like no-one has ever heard of them. going to order one of these bolts, maybe i can get a tool dealer to match it up to something.

Thanks for the help guys, much appreciated.

Moose

[Loren]

The parts list (March 2008) calls the large bolt "hexagonal-head bolt M16 x 1.5 x 48".

Have you tried a hex socket on it?

[Cannoli]

Would this specialty socket work? It is from Snap-On.

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P6...amp;dir=catalog

[Cannoli]

The parts list (March 2008) calls the large bolt "hexagonal-head bolt M16 x 1.5 x 48".

Have you tried a hex socket on it?

That's a strange bolt head ... not a hexagonal head (12 point) for sure - as Moose described earlier, it is a 10 point or spline head.

[Moose-LandTran]

nope. can't use a hex, bi-hex or torx socket on it.

like i said before, it's 10-point and the closest i have to that is a 5-point 12.5mm-flats socket for PSA-Peugeot brake calipers.

may have to get a friend at a Porsche Parts dept to send me a couple of the bolts and i'll have someone machine me custom sockets.

[Cannoli]

I did a quick web search ... that bolt is a "Spline-Drive" head bolt. And you are correct, it is common in the Aerospace/Defense world.

Snap-On has an impact socket for a Spline-Drive ... http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P6...amp;dir=catalog

Here's a website that sells the bolts - give them a call, they may be able to sell you tooling for this bolt.

http://www.fastdim.com/bolts_spline.html

Edited March 13, 2008 by Cannoli

[Loren]

I sent my favorite German tool supplier an email.

I'll let you know what he says...

[Moose-LandTran]

thank you.

i'm one of those people who knows too much about tools and always wants the right tool for the job, but this has me stumped.

[Moose-LandTran]

Cannoli, i came accross that site yesterday, unfortunately they seem to only supply the 12-point Spline bolts. and the Snap-on socket that are #5-Spline are different, #5-Spline is a drive type, like 3/8" square drive. it's roughly equivalent to 1" square drive and isn't often used.

[Cannoli]

I believe I found the socket you'll need.

Snap-On P/N: #FELM10A

Description: Socket, Metric, Spline, Deep, #10, 10 mm Hex

Here's the link:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P6...amp;dir=catalog

And here's the link to the entire spline socket collection:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/catalog2.as...re=snapon-store

Edited March 13, 2008 by Cannoli

[Moose-LandTran]

[

I believe I found the socket you'll need.

Snap-On P/N: #FELM10A

Description: Socket, Metric, Spline, Deep, #10, 10 mm Hex

Here's the link:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P6...amp;dir=catalog

Thought of that one, but again it's 12-point and it's for a ~10mm head. the two heads on this caliper are maybe 13mm and 16mm and 10-point.

[Cannoli]

[

I believe I found the socket you'll need.

Snap-On P/N: #FELM10A

Description: Socket, Metric, Spline, Deep, #10, 10 mm Hex

Here's the link:

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P6...amp;dir=catalog

Thought of that one, but again it's 12-point and it's for a ~10mm head. the two heads on this caliper are maybe 13mm and 16mm and 10-point.

No, Moose, that is a 10-point spline head socket. Give your local Snap-On rep a call. You'll be good as new I'm sure.

[Moose-LandTran]

I'll call a dealer tomorrow, hopefully they can help with this. Spoke to a Mac dealer today but he'd never seen anything like it.

that pic shows 12 points and the page says it's for a 10mm hex. hopefully it's another Snap-on page where they've copied over as little data as possible and it turns out to be right, but i'm not counting on it.

if all else fails, i'll get my friend at Porsche Parts dept to send me one of each of these bolts and i can get a company i know to make me sockets for them.

i plan on getting the Aerospace spline sockets anyway, but not counting on them being useful for this. as if it wasn't bad enough VW-Audi cars using xzn-spline, ribe etc..

[Cannoli]

Great ... sounds like you got a plan. Best of luck, and be easy on your knuckles!

[Moose-LandTran]

haha, thanks.

tools come first, work comes second, knuckles come third..

[Loren]

Got a first reply back - they are talking to a guy in Germany. Should have an answer by Monday or Tuesday...

[Moose-LandTran]

Awesome, Thanks!

[RFM]

Moose

I'm not sure for the US, but on European 08 turbo's it is prohibited to loose the special bolts ( 4 bolts ). To replace the pads, loosen the 2 threaded joints for the wheel carrier ( hexagon ) on the inner side of the wheel.

[Moose-LandTran]

prohibited? like it'll void the warranty or what?

and also, if that's not how you replace the pads, what are they for?

i didn't do the brake work, one of the techs did it.

[RFM]

This special bolts hold the caliper to the reinforcement, you have only to remove both hexagon bolts which hold the reinforcement to the hub carrier to change the pads. A golden Porsche brake system rule is: every in the SAME color PAINTED bolt as the CALIPER is prohibited area for REGULAR service. Can you imagine what the owner will do after he have observed the destroyed red painted calipers ?