Feedback on this 911 please

[Endaar]

Hi all,

At the suggestion of a few members here, I've focused my search for a 911 Cabrio to the 2002 model year. I've found one I like that's a Certified Pre-Owned car; unfortunately it's ~700 miles away so I'm trying to gather as much info as possible before making the decision to travel to see it in person. I'd appreciate any feedback anyone can offer.

http://tinyurl.com/25pxzk

2002 911 Cabrio 6-spd

Speed Yellow / Black

40K miles

Bi-Xenon lights, Bose Audio

Overall, a lightly optioned car, which I'm fine with. There's nothing missing that I can't live without, and my thinking is I'm better off with a cerified car and the associated Porsche warranty rather than taking a chance on buying a car privately or through a non-Porsche dealer. Honestly, reading all the "catostrophic engine failure" threads here has me a bit scared to not have a warranty.

Asking price is $48K, which is at the top end of my budget. I haven't negotiated at all yet.

It's a two owner car, originally bought in NY and now in SC, traded in on a 911 Turbo. Car seems to have been reguarly serviced through 15K miles; at this point I'm not aware of any service history past that. Dealer said they pulled a national warranty history and that history shows no warranty repairs.

Claimed to be original paint, no accidents, no frame damage. I spent a number of years in the car business, so I'm pretty confident that once I see the car in person and up on a lift I'll know if it's been hit. I've got a bunch more pictures of the body other than what's in the listing; they look good. All the panel gaps look correct, no waves in the paint, etc. Front bumper is marked up from the plate bracket (picture attached), which is not a huge issue as long as it will be covered once the bracket is back on. I'm waiting on a shot of the option sticker and a few other pictures.

So what am I missing and what else should I be asking?

Many thanks,

Endaar

Edited August 8, 2007 by Endaar

[Loren]

My advice is get a CarFax, ask for any service records, get a PPI.

I am sending you via PM that cars factory options (that VIN only). You should check to see what has been removed (if anything) and what has been added.

[chaser]

Just a couple of thoughts. Has the 30k check been accomplished? If not will they do it as part of the purchase agreement. I would also want to see the DME readout.

[Endaar]

Thanks Loren, the options printout is very helpful.

Turns out, the car has PSM and the 6 CD changer, neither of which I knew about. It looks like it came with a hardtop, which is MIA, but that's not really a concern.

Only thing that stands out otherwise is that the car shipped on 18" wheels and is now on 17"s. Original dealer may have done a wheel swap - I've seen that happen, but is it something to be concerned about?

I don't know if the 30K was done - I'll find out. It looks like most of that however is stuff that would be done when the car is certified though, right? Which reminds me I need to get a copy of the certification checklist.

DME is the engine computer? Will reading the codes result in something they'd be able to fax/e-mail me?

Thanks again!

[Loren]

I think you are correct - dealers swap wheels on cars all the time. 17's are probably a better autocross tire but other than that there is no real advantage or disadvantage (IMHO).

A Porsche dealer or a shop with a PST2 or PIWIS tester should run a fault report along with a DME report - print it out and fax it to you.

You will get engine operating hours, airbag hours, Number of ignitions, range 1 (over revs that the rev limiter did control), and more important Number of ignitions, range 2 (over revs that the rev limiter could not control i.e. missed shifts, or spins). Of course they should print out and be ready to correct any faults that are reported.

A typical report might look something like (some of these faults are ok because the owner had disconnected the battery):

Range 1 over revs = ok.

Range 2 over revs = not good (this car had no Range 2 over revs).

19.04.2007

18:26:02

911 (996) DME Vehicle data

Number of ignitions, range 1

5918 941.0 h

Number of ignitions, range 2

- -

Operating hours counter

941.8

Vehicle Identification Nr.

WP0xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Type ID DME control unit

996US010

Order type

996110

Country code

C02

Engine type

9601

Engine number

66X

Transmission type

G9600

Transmission number

0000000

Radio/PCM code

0000

Body color/convertible top color

39V

Interior equipment

AS0

M numbers

...

Z numbers

...

Exclusive numbers

19.04.2007

18:01:48

911 (996) Alarm system Fault memory

Number of faults: 6

10 Voltage failure at terminal 30

with alarm system active

61 Central locking limit position

Unlock not reached

48 Airbag signal acknowledged

60 Central locking limit position

Lock not reached

23 W lead

33 Passenger compartment

monitoring sensor

19.04.2007

18:06:58

911 (996) Alarm system Events

Number of events: 6

1 Alarm actuation by "locked"

contact on driver's side

Activation: after battery connect.

2 Alarm actuation by "locked"

contact on driver's side

Activation: secured via radio

3 Alarm actuation by driver's

door

Activation: secured via lock

4 Alarm actuation by oddments

tray

Activation: secured via lock

5 Alarm actuated by passenger

compartment monitoring

Activation: secured via lock

6 Alarm actuation by "locked"

contact on driver's side

Activation: secured via radio

19.04.2007

18:13:15

911 (996) POSIP Fault memory

Number of faults: 1

3 Power supply

19.04.2007

18:17:22

911 (996) Air conditioning Fault memory

Number of faults: 1

24 Supply voltage (terminal 15)

[demosan]

Hi all,

At the suggestion of a few members here, I've focused my search for a 911 Cabrio to the 2002 model year. I've found one I like that's a Certified Pre-Owned car; unfortunately it's ~700 miles away so I'm trying to gather as much info as possible before making the decision to travel to see it in person. I'd appreciate any feedback anyone can offer.

http://tinyurl.com/25pxzk

2002 911 Cabrio 6-spd

Speed Yellow / Black

40K miles

Bi-Xenon lights, Bose Audio

Overall, a lightly optioned car, which I'm fine with. There's nothing missing that I can't live without, and my thinking is I'm better off with a cerified car and the associated Porsche warranty rather than taking a chance on buying a car privately or through a non-Porsche dealer. Honestly, reading all the "catostrophic engine failure" threads here has me a bit scared to not have a warranty.

Asking price is $48K, which is at the top end of my budget. I haven't negotiated at all yet.

It's a two owner car, originally bought in NY and now in SC, traded in on a 911 Turbo. Car seems to have been reguarly serviced through 15K miles; at this point I'm not aware of any service history past that. Dealer said they pulled a national warranty history and that history shows no warranty repairs.

Claimed to be original paint, no accidents, no frame damage. I spent a number of years in the car business, so I'm pretty confident that once I see the car in person and up on a lift I'll know if it's been hit. I've got a bunch more pictures of the body other than what's in the listing; they look good. All the panel gaps look correct, no waves in the paint, etc. Front bumper is marked up from the plate bracket (picture attached), which is not a huge issue as long as it will be covered once the bracket is back on. I'm waiting on a shot of the option sticker and a few other pictures.

So what am I missing and what else should I be asking?

Many thanks,

Endaar

Endaar,

Having looked at many 02 Pcars last year ( I was looking for a C4S coupe) , you should be paying no more that $45K for that car with 40k miles. Car looks good and as others have suggested do a PPI to isolate any obvious ( and not so obvious ) issues.

Good luck!! :cheers: demosan

[Endaar]

Got about 9 pages of a DME report. Including what looks important; let me know if there's anything else to check.

Number of ignitions, range 1: 761

Number of ignitions, range 2: 3

Outside RPM range (upper): 1385.5h

Outside RPM range (lower): 798.9h

Whole bunch of timing, crank position, etc. readings that I can't make heads or tails of.

Alarm events look pretty normal.

Operating hours: 1475h

Under Instrument Cluster section:

Number of Faults: 0

Number of Events: 3

1. Brake distributor

2. Oil pressure too low

3. ABS failure

Roll over protection activated once

Also got the cert checklist:

No faults shown. No indication of collision damage. 50% on the brake pads, 7mm on the tires.

So, thoughts?

Thanks again.

[Loren]

You have removed one variable of many - so far so good.

My advice still to get a CarFax, ask for any service records, get a PPI.

BTW... Where are you located and where is the car located?

[Endaar]

Thanks Loren. So the three range 2 overrevs aren't anything to get too worked up about?

I have a Carfax - it's clean. The car's been serviced reguarly; I haven't had them fax the book (I have the mileages, etc.) but it's there and shows the history.

As for a PPI - my thinking was that the CPO warranty pretty much addresses mechanical concerns, and having spent enough years appraising cars, I'm not really worried about missing paint/body/frame damage once I see the car in person. Does that make sense or not?

I'm in NY, the car is in SC. Any other time of the year I'd have already flown down to look at it; unfortunately this is the worst time of the year for me at work and pretty much makes it impossible to take any time off.

To answer an earlier question, the 30k service was done at 25k miles.

Thanks as always.

[Loren]

So the three range 2 overrevs aren't anything to get too worked up about?

Nope, the smaller the number the better.

[whs]

Where is the car in SC? You might be able to get someone close to go take a look. I'm in SC, but probably not close to where the car is.

Will

[Endaar]

It's in Greenville. I'm not familiar with SC so not really sure where that's near - pretty far inland, in the NW part of the state.

I certainly wouldn't expect it, but if someone nearby is so inclined to take a peek at the car, that'd be great.

Thanks all.

[Endaar]

Well, after a lot of consideration, I'm going to pass on this car for now. Everything I've seen shows it to be a solid, no-stories car, but truthfully I haven't shopped enough to make an intelligent decision, especially on an out of state car. I do appreciate all the help, as it gave me a lot of info that will help in my continued search.

Thanks,

Endaar