Brake ducts revisited...

[geoff]

I know this has been discussed in the past, but this question is slightly different. While browsing the Suncoast weekly specials, I saw the 997 GT3 brake ducts advertised - http://e-partssales.com/Merchant2/merchant...ategory_Code=WS

Unlike the cup/RS brake ducts (brake spoilers?), these look like they're more effective than stock, but still about the same size, so they won't be scraping off on the first parking lot speed bump. Plus they're not ridiculously expensive like the cup/RS ones ($30 vs. $240)

The question is, will these fit on a 2001 Boxster? Suncoast lists them as fitting the Cayman, 997 and 987, and from searching past posts, the 997 and 996 brake ducts look like they are interchangeable (997 has a 996 part number even), and the 986 and 996 fronts are essentially the same. So from this, I can assume they should fit an old Boxster. Just wanted to see if anyone had any thoughts one way or another.

From looking at the online PET, I think the 997 GT3 brake duct part numbers (L/R) are 997-341-483-92 and 997-341-484-92 and the regular 997 ducts are 996-341-483-05 and 996-341-484-05. The original 986 ducts look like they have part numbers 996-341-483-483-01 and 996-341-484-01. Interestingly, the retail part search shows the GT3 ducts at under $9 each side, whereas all the others are over $20 each side

[blinkwatt]

Do you happen to know the part # for the 996 GT3 brake ducts?

Edited July 13, 2007 by blinkwatt

[Loren]

Do you happen to know the part # for the 996 GT3 brake ducts?

Which ones? There are 3 different part numbers for 996 GT3 brake ducts including the GT3 RS ducts.

[steve_wilwerding]

Do you happen to know the part # for the 996 GT3 brake ducts?

Which ones? There are 3 different part numbers for 996 GT3 brake ducts including the GT3 RS ducts.

i think he was asking about the part number for the "street" 996 GT3.

I'm interested in this topic as well - I would like to get better brake cooling during DE events, but I don't want to drop $300, either.

[Loren]

996.341.117.90 Left GT3 (mk1) brake duct

996.341.118.90 Right GT3 (mk1) brake duct

MSRP -- $128.97 (each)

[blinkwatt]

Interestingly, the retail part search shows the GT3 ducts at under $9 each side, whereas all the others are over $20 each side

I just got off the phone with Sunset, the GT3(street) ducts are $109/each.

[geoff]

Interestingly, the retail part search shows the GT3 ducts at under $9 each side, whereas all the others are over $20 each side

I just got off the phone with Sunset, the GT3(street) ducts are $109/each.

I did a little more research since I'm not very motivated at work today and my curiosity was raised.

I emailed Suncoast and here's the reply:

The 997 GT3 ducts will fit, no problem there. There is a big difference

between the 997 GT3 ducts and the much larger GT3 RS ducts. The 997 GT3

ducts will be slightly larger than your stock version, but they "cup" they

air, and channel the air towards the rotors. The 996 GT3 RS ducts are

almost double the size of the stock Boxster spoilers, and will cram air into

the rotors. They are so large that they may have to be trimmed if you have

smaller wheels. If you want to increase the airflow, go for the 997

version. If you want to move a bunch of air, go for the big GT3 RS version.

The price difference..........it could be the size, application, one could

be a Porsche Motorsports part, I'm not sure. It's Porsche, anything is

possible. Let me know if you have any other questions, have a great

weekend!

Then I called Sunset. They also confirmed the 997 GT3 ducts will fit no problem, should shove a little more air into the brakes, and their price each side is $7.94! Quite a bit cheaper than the stock 997 ducts, and a whole lot cheaper than the RS or Cup car brake ducts. Not sure if Porsche figured out how to make the parts cheaper, if it's a pricing mistake, or just one of those unexplained things. But for $16 (half the price of Suncoast's weekly special price) I can afford to experiment. About one week out from them before they ship to me. Certainly one of the cheapest Porsche "performance" part I've seen. I'll post some pictures when they arrive.

[blinkwatt]

Then I called Sunset. They also confirmed the 997 GT3 ducts will fit no problem, should shove a little more air into the brakes, and their price each side is $7.94!

I need parts #s A.S.A.P.! 997-341-483-92 and 997-341-484-92 are the correct 997 GT3 brake ducts correct?

But for $16

Amazing price! Why in the world are the 996 GT3 ducts $100+/each then the 997 GT3s are not even 10% the price of the 996 GT3?

Edited July 14, 2007 by blinkwatt

[geoff]

Then I called Sunset. They also confirmed the 997 GT3 ducts will fit no problem, should shove a little more air into the brakes, and their price each side is $7.94!

I need parts #s A.S.A.P.! 997-341-483-92 and 997-341-484-92 are the correct 997 GT3 brake ducts correct?

But for $16

Amazing price! Why in the world are the 996 GT3 ducts $100+/each then the 997 GT3s are not even 10% the price of the 996 GT3?

Sounds like the conversation I had with them. :D The part number from the online PET, in my first post and yours that I quoted, are what Sunset came up with and what I ordered. (Not sure if that's the same part advertised by Suncoast, but I would guess so) Pricing probably follows the same logic as to why left and right side parts are sometimes different prices - some internal pricing model more secret, obscure and proprietary than anything Google uses. Or maybe these things are expected to break every month and they want everyone to keep replacing them. Who knows? Actually, the cost is just under $16, since the price they quoted for each side is $7.94. Makes no sense to me either

I had considered the RS ducts, but couldn't stomach the price, heard they would probably scrape and break off, and really gave up on the idea when I read somewhere that the bigger ducts were made for larger disks, and would actually channel the air to where the calipers would sit on larger disks. Effectively channeling more air to the wrong location and less air than the stock ducts where it's needed for cooling. These hopefully won't have that problem, but easy to experiement with at this price. I can probably keep one side stock, switch the other side to the new ducts, go for a ride, then measure temps on each side with a laser thermometer to see if there's any difference

Since the shipping was about the same as the price of each duct, I added some other small odds and ends like wiper blades and the new (2002 and newer) style cigarette lighter to the order, since the incremental cost is essentially nil. You might want to figure out any other small doodads you need/want to piggyback on the shipping cost. It's always struck me as silly to save money ordering parts online, then spend twice as much on shipping

[blinkwatt]

the new (2002 and newer) style cigarette lighter to the order

What's the difference between my 99' and the 02' cig. lighter?

[geoff]

the new (2002 and newer) style cigarette lighter to the order

What's the difference between my 99' and the 02' cig. lighter?

I think the 2002+ are deeper and more consistent with the American standard size. Up to 2001 was the European size lighter socket. If your cell phone charger or other plugs don't fit well and tend to fall out, you probably have the earlier style. See http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?s...arette++lighter and http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?s...arette++lighter for starters. There's a lot more info if you search. The two styles are not interchangeable, so you need to replace both the socket and the lighter

[blinkwatt]

I had considered the RS ducts, but couldn't stomach the price, heard they would probably scrape and break off, and really gave up on the idea when I read somewhere that the bigger ducts were made for larger disks, and would actually channel the air to where the calipers would sit on larger disks. Effectively channeling more air to the wrong location and less air than the stock ducts where it's needed for cooling. These hopefully won't have that problem, but easy to experiement with at this price. I can probably keep one side stock, switch the other side to the new ducts, go for a ride, then measure temps on each side with a laser thermometer to see if there's any difference

Please let us know how it turns out,I'm interested in the mod.

[mee]

Please let us know how it turns out,I'm interested in the mod.

Ditto. If you have a camera handy, please post a pic of the old/new side-by-side. Thanks!

[blinkwatt]

Any updates Geoff?

[geoff]

Any updates Geoff?

I'm in Colorado on a business trip this week, and on an east coast business trip next week. I haven't seen a tracking number from Sunset yet, so I'm guessing they're still awaiting the brake ducts from Porsche. Based on experience, estimates to receive parts from Porsche tend to be overly optimistic - I'm not holding my breath. As an example, I ordered my ROW M030 suspension kit late last December and it finally showed up at the end of June!

I'll post pictures and info as soon as I get the brake ducts and can figure out how to get the old ones off for a side by side comparison

[blinkwatt]

Any updates Geoff?

As an example, I ordered my ROW M030 suspension kit late last December and it finally showed up at the end of June!

That had to be a mistake by Sunset. I ordered my RoW 030 kit for my 5spd at the end of April and had it installed by mid-May.

So hopefully they will be there when you get back.

[geoff]

Any updates Geoff?

As an example, I ordered my ROW M030 suspension kit late last December and it finally showed up at the end of June!

That had to be a mistake by Sunset. I ordered my RoW 030 kit for my 5spd at the end of April and had it installed by mid-May.

So hopefully they will be there when you get back.

Sunset said Porsche messed up my M030 order. In all fairness to them, I wasn't pressuring them to get it here any faster, although I did call to check every few weeks. In the process, I found out there are various ROW M030 flavors, depending on year and whether it's a base or 'S' model. Some flavors were available, and mine (for a 2001 base Boxster) seemed to be hard to come by. Now that it's been installed for two weeks and I've driven it a few times, I wish I got it sooner

When I got home tonight from Colorado, there was a box from Sunset at my house, with brake ducts. It's too late to do anything with them, and I'm too tired now. But I'll try to post more info before I leave town next Monday

[geoff]

Spent a little time this weekend playing with the new ducts and trying to get the old ones off. It looks so simple, but I must be in weekend non-thinking mode and couldn't get the old ducts off. I'll have to do some research on how they attach and try again next weekend when I'm back in town. The 997 GT3 brake ducts look like they're about 40% larger area, but more curves to funnel the airflow. The stock 986 has a semi-circular cutout for part of the front suspension, while the GT3 version doesn't. Not sure if I'll have to cut part of a hole for clearance or not. The new ones don't look like they'll stick down much farther, so probably less likelihood of breaking off on speed bumps. I'm waiting to get the old ones off so I can post side-by-side pictures.

If anyone has any tips on getting the brake ducts off, technique, tools or whatever helps, I would certainly appreciate it. I've read it takes just a few minutes, but I stopped before I got too frustrated and broke something.

[kirkbox]

After seeing the discussion on here I bought a set of the GT3 (non-RS) ducts from Suncoast for my '99 Boxster for about $30 and installed them this past weekend. Took less than an hour, including a little cleanup. Remove your front wheels first. You might want to do a bit of de-greasing/cleanup so you can see what you're doing. Then you remove the old ducts by "unbuckling" the two tabs holding them onto the lower suspension arm -- I used a large screwdriver blade as a lever to unlatch the tabs. It's a bit hard to describe, but there's one part of the tab that goes over the arm and has a hook, the other tab under the arm is an open loop that the upper hooked tab fits into. When you unlatch the two hooks, you can bend the plastic tabs back, and work the duct off of the lower arm. towards the front of the car. Observe how it comes off, as this is the same way you install the new one. Be careful not to break any of the tabs off. The new ducts are a bit bigger and stick down much more than the OEM Boxster ducts. Next time I make it to the track we'll see how much improvement they make in reducing brake fade.

[seafeye]

After seeing the discussion on here I bought a set of the GT3 (non-RS) ducts from Suncoast for my '99 Boxster for about $30 and installed them this past weekend. Took less than an hour, including a little cleanup. Remove your front wheels first. You might want to do a bit of de-greasing/cleanup so you can see what you're doing. Then you remove the old ducts by "unbuckling" the two tabs holding them onto the lower suspension arm -- I used a large screwdriver blade as a lever to unlatch the tabs. It's a bit hard to describe, but there's one part of the tab that goes over the arm and has a hook, the other tab under the arm is an open loop that the upper hooked tab fits into. When you unlatch the two hooks, you can bend the plastic tabs back, and work the duct off of the lower arm. towards the front of the car. Observe how it comes off, as this is the same way you install the new one. Be careful not to break any of the tabs off. The new ducts are a bit bigger and stick down much more than the OEM Boxster ducts. Next time I make it to the track we'll see how much improvement they make in reducing brake fade.

Pictures i need pictures....

[steve_wilwerding]

Here are your pics - I just installed these tonight.

First pic - original 1998 Boxster brake duct on top, 997 "street" GT3 duct on bottom:

Here's what it looks like on the car - definitely lower and more of a scoop than the originals, but not any lower than the front mud flap:

A few things - you'll notice in the first picture that they have roughly the same profile on the right side, which is the side nearest the rotor, so you don't have to trim any plastic off like you do with the GT3 RS ducts. Also, as for installation, just look at the new ones and you'll see the clips - one half goes over the top of the control arm, one half over the bottom, and they clip at the back. Took me about 10 minutes, including jacking and removing the wheels, to take the old ones off and get the new ones on.

It will be interesting to see if they make a difference on the track.

[geoff]

Here are your pics - I just installed these tonight.

First pic - original 1998 Boxster brake duct on top, 997 "street" GT3 duct on bottom:

Steve,

When I was looking at my old ones on Sunday trying to figure out how to get them off, I noticed the semi-circular cut out (which you can see in the picture on top). Do the GT3 ducts need to have any cut out to to clear the arm?

Also, on the right side of the GT3 duct in your picture, there are two holes. Are these for a cable tie as an extra to keep the ducts on?

[steve_wilwerding]

Here are your pics - I just installed these tonight.

First pic - original 1998 Boxster brake duct on top, 997 "street" GT3 duct on bottom:

Steve,

When I was looking at my old ones on Sunday trying to figure out how to get them off, I noticed the semi-circular cut out (which you can see in the picture on top). Do the GT3 ducts need to have any cut out to to clear the arm?

Also, on the right side of the GT3 duct in your picture, there are two holes. Are these for a cable tie as an extra to keep the ducts on?

I didn't notice a place where the semi-circular cutouts made a difference - they are actually on the top of the ducts.

I don't think you need to zip tie anything - when you get them in correctly, with all the tabs inside the lip of the control arm, the one is on just as tight as the old one.

[blinkwatt]

Did anyone happen to leave on side 986 brake duct & the other 997 gt3 brake duct,then go out for a spin with hard braking & read the rotor temps?

[geoff]

Did anyone happen to leave on side 986 brake duct & the other 997 gt3 brake duct,then go out for a spin with hard braking & read the rotor temps?

I got back from my last few business trips and did change one side to the GT3 duct. As others have said, the process is to jack up one side, remove the front wheel, and access the brake duct that way. First time I ever jacked up the Boxster, and the jack pad adapter I bought works very nice

I only changed out one side (passenger side) and had time for a few short trips to the grocery store. I used a laser infrared thermometer (buy at Harbor Freight for around $35) to check out the difference in rotor temperature between the two sides. (I didn't get any baseline readings BEFORE changing the ducts, so results may be suspect). The temperature readings I got on the original brake duct side were actually cooler than the temperature readings I got with the GT3 ducts - consistently with 3 test runs. The rotors on the side with the GT3 ducts read about 8-10 degrees hotter at the top of the rotor than the bottom. I'm not sure if something isn't aligned properly, since there is a little fore and aft play of the duct on the arm, so I'll play around with it a little more before deciding whether to go back to stock or swap out the other side. These were only short (5 mile) drives along PCH (50+/- MPH) and streets to my house with stop signs. Rotor temperature (90-100) was around 15 degrees (F) higher than the outside temperature (75ish). This is initial results from neither high speed driving/braking, nor a longer distance. At this point, for all I know, the radiator heat could be the biggest variant. No business trips for the next two weeks, so I can drive and get more data points.

Somewhat disappointing results, but not 100% unexpected. I read somewhere that the GT3 Cup ducts on a Boxster put all the air in the wrong place (below the calipers and rotors), and are actually less effective than the stock ducts. This could be the same :o