4 Wheel Alignment done... need 2nd opinions

[CJ_Boxster]

4 Wheel Alignment done... need 2nd opinions

Ok just got done with my 4 wheel alignment, My rear was Rear Toe was outline, and so was my front toe... Attached is the paper they gave me of BEFORE, SHOULD BE, and AFTER.

Let me know if my final suspension setup is good please. The car seems to have less turning responsiveness with the alignment.

1997 Boxster, Factory 17 inch Rims. 225/45/17 in front and rears 255/40/17

[Nick_USA]

Just a thought, your tires were new and you did have a full tank of gas, didn't you ???

[CJ_Boxster]

Just a thought, your tires were new and you did have a full tank of gas, didn't you ???

Yes, Rear tires were new about month and a half ago, front tires just installed before alignment... 1/8th short of full tank.

[mee]

The difference is probably that you had your front toe'd out before and now it's toe'd in. You were running a pretty huge amount of rear toe before. Did your tires last very long? ;)

As far as whether your alignment is good or bad, everybody's got a different opinion on how they like the car to feel, so I won't comment. Before, the front was probably more responsive (some would call darty), and with that much rear toe, you could probably attack any corner without fear. You were probably just shredding those rear tires, though. Now, your rear will rotate more and your tires will wear better. Everything's a trade-off...

P.S. The statistical variation of before and after is kinda interesting because I can almost guarantee the shop didn't touch anything to affect caster or camber. Also, if they did not drive the car around (like over any speed bumps), I would be cautious to make sure that rear toe holds.

[gto3000]

Let me know if my final suspension setup is good please. The car seems to have less turning responsiveness with the alignment.

1997 Boxster, Factory 17 inch Rims. 225/45/17 in front and rears 255/40/17

Did you upgrade your front type ???

The factory - original setup for front 205/50/17 & rear 255/40/17 ! :lightbulb:

[blue2000s]

http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/align.html

[Toby]

CJ,

You new alignment spec looks good.

It may only be placebo effect (or lack thereof?) that you feel your old alignment was more responsive. According to the printout you had too much rear toe in before for the car to turn in well. Your new alignment setting should be much better. (esp. given the almost zero toe.)

If you would like a more responsive setting for a dual use car (daily driver + autocross/track), you should target more camber for your next alignment:

- max negative camber in front (should be around -0.8 to -1.0 for stock suspension)

- about the same camber in the rear (or just slightly more, say -1.7 to -2.0, if you can get to the front camber above)

- same toe as what you have now: zero toe up front, slight toe in in the rear (~1/8 to 1/16 of an inch)

The car will rotate better without being too nervous when you get on the power.

But as I mentioned up top, you specs look fine. There is NO need for you to spend extra $$$ to realign the car now.

Cheers,

Toby

Edited April 2, 2007 by Toby

[Toby]

The difference is probably that you had your front toe'd out before and now it's toe'd in. You were running a pretty huge amount of rear toe before. Did your tires last very long? ;)

As far as whether your alignment is good or bad, everybody's got a different opinion on how they like the car to feel, so I won't comment. Before, the front was probably more responsive (some would call darty), and with that much rear toe, you could probably attack any corner without fear. You were probably just shredding those rear tires, though. Now, your rear will rotate more and your tires will wear better. Everything's a trade-off...

P.S. The statistical variation of before and after is kinda interesting because I can almost guarantee the shop didn't touch anything to affect caster or camber. Also, if they did not drive the car around (like over any speed bumps), I would be cautious to make sure that rear toe holds.

Agreed with the turn (pun intended) for the better re: tire wear and better rotation in the rear.

Although the front toe really hasn't changed. Previously the front tires were (pretty much) parallel to each other, except both tires are pointing to the right. (so CJ you might notice you were steering slightly left to track a straight line) There was minimal toe out (total toe).

I have found the car to hold its alignment reasonably well. I had my car realigned after 25 track days (each with 2 drivers!) last year, and the old alignment setting was pretty much still there.

Cheers,

Toby

Edited April 2, 2007 by Toby

[insite]

Let me know if my final suspension setup is good please. The car seems to have less turning responsiveness with the alignment.

it's not bad. i'd go with zero toe up front and closer to .1 degree toe in at the rear. this will help your turning response. the rear camber variation between right and left should rectify itself when you sit in the car (i.e. both will be -1.6) which is good. in the future, i'd go with more neg camber overall. try -0.8 up front and -1.8 in back. overall you have an adequate alignment, but it's one that would drive me nuts personally.

[PTEC]

I guess it depends on what you're going for, maybe looks like they're trying to help the car fight road crown. I might question the rear toe.. it just seems sloppy to leave that much of a difference side to side.

[Toby]

No they are not trying to fight road crown. Most shops will only get you back within spec, which is a lot less work, and hopefull they charge "less" (by Porsche standard).

A detailed alignment costs around $250 at most (independent) shops in the DC area. Overpriced? Possibly... (They do provide a few things for free, like pre-track day tech inspections)

Edited April 5, 2007 by Toby

[PTEC]

Yeah I made the comment about trying to fight the road crown based upon the front camber difference, but alas, I looked too quickly and didn't notice the left front was more negative, which is the opposite of what you would do to fight road crown. Either way if this was for the track, you wouldnt care anyways.

Edited April 8, 2007 by PTEC

[CJ_Boxster]

Well i dont like how the car tracks, i went to the alignment shop twice since the alignment cause it tracks to the right all the time....Even on flat road surfaces without the road crown like a freeway. What should i suggest they do to correct this?

Edited July 11, 2007 by CJ_Boxster

[insite]

Well i dont like how the car tracks, i went to the alignment shop twice since the alignment cause it tracks to the right all the time....Even on flat road surfaces without the road crown like a freeway. What should i suggest they do to correct this?

does it pull to the right or just drift to the right? meaning, if you let go of the wheel, will the car just go a bit to the right, or will the steering wheel turn more and more to the right? how badly is this occuring?

[CJ_Boxster]

Well i can feel the steering wheel pull to the right. If i let it go, the wheel will probably turn about 5 centimeters to the right and the car will steer to the right. It occurs 24/7, never goes away ever since the first alignment they did.

Edited July 11, 2007 by CJ_Boxster

[insite]

Well i can feel the steering wheel pull to the right. If i let it go, the wheel will probably turn about 5 centimeters to the right and the car will steer to the right. It occurs 24/7, never goes away ever since the first alignment they did.

it sounds like you have excessive toe somewhere; probably a bit of toe-out on the front right. check all your tire pressures, then put it on the alignment rack. a lot of times, those guys won't properly inflate the tires before they align the car. i'd do this soon so you save your tire life.

[CJ_Boxster]

Well they did and I did before returning it the first time... they are starting to blame my suspension, they are on the vurge of saying my suspensionis either worn or my car was in a accident...... but seen to forget the fact that it tracked straight before i took it to them,... they also said it could be my new tires quality.... They are Nexen N3000 Z rated tires.

[insite]

Well they did and I did before returning it the first time... they are starting to blame my suspension, they are on the vurge of saying my suspensionis either worn or my car was in a accident...... but seen to forget the fact that it tracked straight before i took it to them,... they also said it could be my new tires quality.... They are Nexen N3000 Z rated tires.

probably not the tires. do you have excessive caster at either front wheel? sounds like you might need a different alignment shop.

[CJ_Boxster]

pretty sure the caster on the wheels are within spec according to the alignment shop print out... but the fact that the person going the alignment looked younger than me (im 24) WORRIES ME! I called my father, turns out they have a 4 wheel alignment machine, Pops is going to have his men look at it for me saturday. Ill post the results/update that nite.