K&N filter...

[Peer]

CJ Boxster wrote:

> You can clean the oils out of the K&N filter to avoid that

> problem BUT you do run the risk of more dust flying past

> the filter, I've done it and havent had an issue with it...

> also desnorkeled and the car sounds awesome.

Correct me if I'm wrong -- I thought the K&N filter came un-oiled, but was included with a small tube of oil so you could oil it yourself if so desired.

At least so did the one I got for my Ducati:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/Duc/duc-jetting.html

..and the same for my Eunos:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/roadster-intake.html

Hence, if no one can/will talk me out of this, I'm about to install a K&N also in my Boxster.

-- peer

[John V]

CJ Boxster wrote:

> You can clean the oils out of the K&N filter to avoid that

> problem BUT you do run the risk of more dust flying past

> the filter, I've done it and havent had an issue with it...

> also desnorkeled and the car sounds awesome.

Correct me if I'm wrong -- I thought the K&N filter came un-oiled, but was included with a small tube of oil so you could oil it yourself if so desired.

At least so did the one I got for my Ducati:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/Duc/duc-jetting.html

..and the same for my Eunos:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/roadster-intake.html

Hence, if no one can/will talk me out of this, I'm about to install a K&N also in my Boxster.

-- peer

The K&N is supposed to be oiled for proper filtration. It won't filter as well without oil.

Peer, don't do it. You won't see any horsepower increase from installing a K&N on the Boxster, and they don't filter nearly as well as the OEM paper filter. You're wasting money to wear your engine out faster. False economy.

John

[SkipC]

The K&N is supposed to be oiled for proper filtration. It won't filter as well without oil.

Peer, don't do it. You won't see any horsepower increase from installing a K&N on the Boxster, and they don't filter nearly as well as the OEM paper filter. You're wasting money to wear your engine out faster. False economy.

John

Any thoughts on a K & N on a 1984 Carrera ?

Thanks, Skip

[John V]

Any thoughts on a K & N on a 1984 Carrera ?

Thanks, Skip

I don't know anything about those cars, but I suspect the horsepower gains are minimal and thus in my mind it doesn't make sense. The factory filter is better as a filter, so that's what I'll keep using.

[CJ_Boxster]

CJ Boxster wrote:

> You can clean the oils out of the K&N filter to avoid that

> problem BUT you do run the risk of more dust flying past

> the filter, I've done it and havent had an issue with it...

> also desnorkeled and the car sounds awesome.

Correct me if I'm wrong -- I thought the K&N filter came un-oiled, but was included with a small tube of oil so you could oil it yourself if so desired.

At least so did the one I got for my Ducati:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/Duc/duc-jetting.html

..and the same for my Eunos:

http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~peer/roadster-intake.html

Hence, if no one can/will talk me out of this, I'm about to install a K&N also in my Boxster.

-- peer

That tube that comes with the filter is not oil, its grease that you apply to the air filter track that the boxster uses, the KN filter is a tighter fit than the OEM filter and the tube of grease on the track helps it slide into the airbox.

I didnt install the filter for any performance gains just to help the intake noise increase and I never heard anyone say "Hey that K&N filter wore out my engine" so i dont think SkipC's reason for not using a K&N is valid. I mean i use to drive my 67 mustang without an airfilter, daily driver too and no issues with debris or unfiltered air "wearing out" my engine... <_<

[John V]

I didnt install the filter for any performance gains just to help the intake noise increase and I never heard anyone say "Hey that K&N filter wore out my engine" so i dont think SkipC's reason for not using a K&N is valid. I mean i use to drive my 67 mustang without an airfilter, daily driver too and no issues with debris or unfiltered air "wearing out" my engine... <_<

Oh my goodness. Where to start?

Let me start with an anecdote. One of my good friends, who has owned his car since new, also has had oil analysis done on his car's oil since new. The neat thing about oil analysis is it can track trends in wear metals, particulates, even the additive structure of motor oil. His oil analysis detected the formula change that Mobil 1 enacted in the late 90's.

One month he saw a spike in silicon on his oil analysis sheet, and a corresponding spike in wear metals (mainly lead). The oil analysis folks write some suggestions and comments on the sheet. One of the comments was along the lines of "check your air filter."

Sure enough, his K&N had a slight tear in it, about big enough for a quarter on-end to fit through. But this tear was enough to let grit into the engine, make its way into the oil system, and start tearing things up. Would he have seen an engine failure 10, 20, 30k down the road? Probably not. Would it affect the lifespan of the engine? You bet. Saying that you did something once and didn't notice any adverse effects is akin to consciously deciding to smoke. Will you start coughing right away? Will you get cancer in ten years? Probably not... ;)

The bottom line is it is a personal decision. Up to you entirely!

Bear in mind that Porsche's MAF sensors are VERY sensitive to contamination, even with the stock filter in place! The slight amount of oil that is passed by a K&N is easily enough to foul it up. Since there is no performance gain, to me it is not worth the risk. But if a slight increase in sound is worth the risk to you, go for it!

Edited March 1, 2007 by John V

[Tool Pants]

I never liked the K&N hype. In my younger days I had had 3 cars with filters that used oil to trap contaminants, but they were not K&N. Even had one on my motorcycle. I was into the hype back then. At our local events I have put in K&N and BMC filters for the local owners - it is their car. I have owned my Boxster for 8 years and I am sticking to the paper air filter.

K&N comes with a K&N sticker that you can stick on your car. If you are still under warranty do not stick it on the air box in case you have a problem with the air flow sensor. I do not know if this is still true, but for a while if you air flow sensor was replaced by a dealer under warranty the sensor and the filter had to be sent back to Atlanta as poof you were not using an oiled filter.

If your goal is to hear more induction noise then you can remove the layer of foam from the stock filter. Zero cost and you still have a paper filter.

K&N - the world's best filter. Flows more air. Superior filtration properties.

Then what? No filter. A dirty filter. On what application. Hype.

If you need to flow more air then remove your filter. Years ago we had a local Boxster dyno day to test filters. It has been a long time but I remember one of the best hp gain was no filter.

I have a 1988 Toyota pickup that I have owned for 18 years. I figured out a way to meet the K&N claims. Stack 2 filters. :lol:

[mxdave74]

John's advice is sound. The question is not whether your engine will grind to a halt a year or more from now. The question is... is there substantial evidence that this filter will enhance the performance of my stock Boxster?, I think the answer is, no. I believe that a K&N style filter is only going to make a reasonable difference in the Boxster when it's used in a well designed replacement intake, not the OEM unit. And frankly, even under that scenario, we're not talking about enough horsepower to notice the difference or justify the cost.

Don't risk your $10K engine on a filter unless you really know what you're getting into, AND it presents a worthwhile enhancement! The biggest issue I've seen with using these filters over the last 20 year (yes, I do use them, though not in my GT3) is how the owner treats the filter. Frankly, most people are not detail oriented enough to look after an oiled cotton gauze filter year after year. Some wash them too much, some wash them too little, and an awful lot of other do not properly apply oil.

K&N makes a good product, but it significantly complicates the simple act of air filter maintenance.

Edited March 1, 2007 by mxdave74

[mxdave74]

Carlos,

Please, please, please don't run your Boxster without an air filter!! :P I know you long for those glory days with the old Mustang, but while your Boxster would continue running 10 years from now, it would also be measurably down on horsepower.... just as I'm sure your Mustang was.

Peer, It seems as though K&Ns and their competitiors have all been coming oiled in recent years, though there may be exceptions. With K&N it's very easy to tell... If the cotton gauze is pink/red, then it's oiled and ready to go.

Edited March 1, 2007 by mxdave74

[Peer]

John V wrote:

> Peer, don't do it. You won't see any horsepower increase from installing a K&N

> on the Boxster, and they don't filter nearly as well as the OEMpaper filter.

> You're wasting money to wear your engine out faster. False economy. [...]

> Bear in mind that Porsche's MAF sensors are VERY sensitive to contamination,

> even with the stock filter in place! The slight amount of oil that is passed

> by a K&N is easily enough to foul it up. Since there is no performance gain,

> to me it is not worth the risk.

Okay, that's convincing enough -- no more K&N for me. Thank you guys.

-- peer

[CJ_Boxster]

I didnt install the filter for any performance gains just to help the intake noise increase and I never heard anyone say "Hey that K&N filter wore out my engine" so i dont think SkipC's reason for not using a K&N is valid. I mean i use to drive my 67 mustang without an airfilter, daily driver too and no issues with debris or unfiltered air "wearing out" my engine... <_<

Sure enough, his K&N had a slight tear in it, about big enough for a quarter on-end to fit through.

See that doesnt apply here, cause the spike accured while the filter had a tear in it. Did the individual replace the filter with a new K&N then re-test?

[CJ_Boxster]

I never liked the K&N hype. In my younger days I had had 3 cars with filters that used oil to trap contaminants, but they were not K&N. Even had one on my motorcycle. I was into the hype back then. At our local events I have put in K&N and BMC filters for the local owners - it is their car. I have owned by Boxster for 8 years and I am sticking to the paper air filter.

If your goal is to hear more induction noise then remove the layer of foam from the stock filter.

K&N - the world's best filter. Flows more air. Superior filtration properties.

Then what? No filter. A dirty filter. On what application. Hype.

If you need to flow more air then remove your filter. Years ago we had a local Boxster dyno day to test filters. It has been a long time but I remember one of the best hp gains was no filter.

I have a 1988 Toyota pickup that I have owned for 18 years. I figured out a way to meet the K&N claims. Stack 2 filters. :lol:

LOL your right, stacking 2 filters as you did will increase air flow cause there is more element area to pull air from. While its true, i wouldnt have thought of doing that. :clapping:

[CJ_Boxster]

Carlos,

Please, please, please don't run your Boxster without an air filter!! :P I know you long for those glory days with the old Mustang, but while your Boxster would continue running 10 years from now, it would also be measurably down on horsepower.... just as I'm sure your Mustang was.

Peer, It seems as though K&Ns and their competitiors have all been coming oiled in recent years, though there may be exceptions. With K&N it's very easy to tell... If the cotton gauze is pink/red, then it's oiled and ready to go.

Haha, i would never do that to my boxster. Weird thing about the mustang, the coolant temps would increase abit without an airfilter... Guess too lean for that a/f ratio.

[John V]

I didnt install the filter for any performance gains just to help the intake noise increase and I never heard anyone say "Hey that K&N filter wore out my engine" so i dont think SkipC's reason for not using a K&N is valid. I mean i use to drive my 67 mustang without an airfilter, daily driver too and no issues with debris or unfiltered air "wearing out" my engine... <_<

Sure enough, his K&N had a slight tear in it, about big enough for a quarter on-end to fit through.

See that doesnt apply here, cause the spike accured while the filter had a tear in it. Did the individual replace the filter with a new K&N then re-test?

Carlos, with all due respect, you're missing the point. The point is that yes, additional grit coming into your engine can have a direct and measurable effect on engine wear. The K&N filters have proven to filter less well than a factory paper filter. Seems a silly risk to take for no gain.

[Tool Pants]

I wish K&N would get into the lawn mower air filter business. :lightbulb:

I found a Sears Craftsman lawn mover with a Tecumseh engine. Side valve, vertical shaft, 185 cc, 6 hp. Air-cooled like a real Porsche. It would not run for more than a few seconds. I rebuild the carburetor and now it runs like new. Starts on the first pull like an Eager-1 should.

During my test run I did not put the paper air filter on. Think of all the stuff that a lawn mower engine can suck in, like burning cigarette butts, and the Tecumseh engine uses a paper air filter. You should have heard the awesome induction sound with no air filter. From my seat-of-the-pants testing after the rebuild and without the air filter on, I would estimate 6.001 hp.

I just need to find a filter than can flow more air and I think I can boost it up to 6.002 hp. Or maybe I will stack 2 filters together like I did on the Toyota. Two air filters will flow more air....

[John V]

I wish K&N would get into the lawn mover air filter business. :lightbulb:

I found a Sears Craftsman lawn mover with a Tecumseh engine. Side valve, vertical shaft, 185 cc, 6 hp. Air-cooled like a real Porsche. It would not run for more than a few seconds. I rebuild the carburetor and now it runs like new. Starts on the first pull like an Eager-1 should.

During my test run I did not put the paper air filter on. Think of all the stuff that a lawn mower engine can suck in, like burning cigarette butts, and the Tecumseh engine uses a paper air filter. You should have heard the awesome induction sound with no air filter. From my seat-of-the-pants testing after the rebuild and without the air filter on, I would estimate 6.001 hp.

I just need to find a filter than can flow more air and I think I can boost it up to 6.002 hp. Or maybe I will stack 2 filters together like I did on the Toyota. Two air filters will flow more air....

LOL!

I put a K&N on my old motorcycle years ago. It flowed enough more air over a factory paper filter that I had to shim the needles and bump up the main jet one size. For that thing, there was a noticable gain with the filter, and the motorcycle was so cheap that I really didn't care too much what happened to it.

I guess for my $30k car I'm a little more "by the book."

[Loren]

I wish K&N would get into the lawn mover air filter business. :lightbulb:

I found a Sears Craftsman lawn mover with a Tecumseh engine. Side valve, vertical shaft, 185 cc, 6 hp. Air-cooled like a real Porsche. It would not run for more than a few seconds. I rebuild the carburetor and now it runs like new. Starts on the first pull like an Eager-1 should.

During my test run I did not put the paper air filter on. Think of all the stuff that a lawn mower engine can suck in, like burning cigarette butts, and the Tecumseh engine uses a paper air filter. You should have heard the awesome induction sound with no air filter. From my seat-of-the-pants testing after the rebuild and without the air filter on, I would estimate 6.001 hp.

I just need to find a filter than can flow more air and I think I can boost it up to 6.002 hp. Or maybe I will stack 2 filters together like I did on the Toyota. Two air filters will flow more air....

Looks like that thing needs headers and a sport exhaust to me... :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Tool Pants]

Tecumseh sport exhaust. I did not think about that. Another lost business oportunity.

In order to remove the carb I had to take all the stuff off the top of the engine, and then had to remove the muffler in order to get my ratchet wrench socket on the carb bolts.

The muffler has 11 holes. I think I might drill a few more holes in the muffler for a free flowing sport exhaust. Make more noise, like Porsche did with the 993 motor sound option by drilling holes in the air box.

Then hide from my neighbors when I start the mower up....

Maybe I'll de-snorkel it instead. :o

[CJ_Boxster]

I didnt install the filter for any performance gains just to help the intake noise increase and I never heard anyone say "Hey that K&N filter wore out my engine" so i dont think SkipC's reason for not using a K&N is valid. I mean i use to drive my 67 mustang without an airfilter, daily driver too and no issues with debris or unfiltered air "wearing out" my engine... <_<

Sure enough, his K&N had a slight tear in it, about big enough for a quarter on-end to fit through.

See that doesnt apply here, cause the spike accured while the filter had a tear in it. Did the individual replace the filter with a new K&N then re-test?

Carlos, with all due respect, you're missing the point. The point is that yes, additional grit coming into your engine can have a direct and measurable effect on engine wear. The K&N filters have proven to filter less well than a factory paper filter. Seems a silly risk to take for no gain.

John your right i did miss your point there but im back on track now. About the K&N's being proven to filter less well than a factory filter.... thats just common sence, you cant suck more air through a layer of foam and paper than you can a k&n filter. There is risk associated with this mod and since I have a Automotive mechanic background experience with aftermarket air filtering methods, I feel that I probably will never experience total engine failure or even gradual hp lose. But like we say about mods.... To all his/her own! :thumbup:

Edited March 3, 2007 by CJ_Boxster

[mee]

I will side with CJ on this one.

I have put K&N filters in every car I've owned for the past 25 years, some with MAFs and well over 100K miles (some approaching 200K), and I've never encountered any problems nor did the engines wear out prematurely. To each his/her own, of course, but the last thing I worry about with my Boxster is the engine wearing out. The tuners seem to think they add HP, but I would admit it's probably too small to be statistically measurable, but you could say that about a lot of Porsche mods.

I did enjoy the lawnmower pics. Any RMS leaks?

[Tool Pants]

That RMS stuff is for the foreign crap made offshore in Finland and Germany.

The mover is American iron. Craftsman Eager-1. Made for Sears by American Yard Products with a bulletproff Tecumseh engine.

Holds 21 oz of oil. Warmed the mower up and then let it drain for 21 minutes. Used Chevron 10W-30 - the best oil sold by Wal-Mart. No synthetic dino juice here. The mower even has a dipstick. No funny gauge.

I think this oil is not approved by Tecumseh and I overfilled by putting in 22 oz. What should I do? Is it safe to start?

I'm thinking of putting in a lightweight carbon fiber blade so it will get up to speed faster....

[John V]

You might want to take these pictures down. You may have just voided your warranty. :D

[Tool Pants]

I seem to miss out on the business opportunities. Where is Fabspeed when you need them?

My mother is not looking - so - a fart can on a Tecumseh.

I used an MJB European Roast coffee can because it has a green and black label to match the green and black colors of the mower.

Now I got to get me some neon....

[Topless]

Tecumseh sport exhaust. I did not think about that. Another lost business oportunity.

In order to remove the carb I had to take all the stuff off the top of the engine, and then had to remove the muffler in order to get my ratchet wrench socket on the carb bolts.

The muffler has 11 holes. I think I might drill a few more holes in the muffler for a free flowing sport exhaust. Make more noise, like Porsche did with the 993 motor sound option by drilling holes in the air box.

Then hide from my neighbors when I start the mower up....

Maybe I'll de-snorkel it instead. :o

Hmmmmm... still needs somethin'. How about 19" rims, front spoiler, and adjustable rear wing for better mower/grass contact. :thumbup:

[mee]

I seem to miss out on the business opportunities. Where is Fabspeed when you need them?

My mother is not looking - so - a fart can on a Tecumseh.

I used MJB European Roast because it has a green and black label to match the green and black colors of the mower.

Oh my God! Can you say this needs to be on You Tube? :lol: