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Time to do a new swap

tholyoak

By tholyoak
in 986 Series (Boxster, Boxster S)

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Kanin Member

Kanin

Posted
Posted

Hi Todd

I hope you can help.

I am in the process of putting a 3.2L in to my 2.5 97. 2.5 is non egas and the 3.2 is egas. Almost done and in the last phase.

Just a quick question if you could please help.

A specialist advised on using the 2.5 injection system and inlet manifolds on the 3.2 engine but the 2.5 inlet manifold does not fit the 3.2 head.

Can I use the 3.2 inlet manifold? What happens to the pipe that bridges the 3.2 manifold in the back. That pipe has another butterfly in it which is operated by a valve which is on the pipe it self. Because I am using the 2.5 DME and harness and the 2.5 did not have this valve. How is this going to affect the new set-up. Any idea's do I need to plumb this valve up somehow or can I leave it as it is.

Any input would be appreciated.

Br,

Kanin

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pecivil Member

pecivil

Posted
Posted

Todd,

What header/cat/muffler setup did you use for the 3.4?

I bought the setup from Steve Timmons at Instant G and have had major fitament issues with the headers. I may need to go with another setup.

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Kanin,

I would not use the 2.5 intake on the 3.2 even if it can be made to fit. Like the 996, I imagine if you use the single cross plenum manifold you will lose significant performance. How are you getting around the egas? Personally if it were me, I would reprogram the brain to the '99 996 program that shares your stock dme, install the 3.2 with a throttle cable throttle body (from your 2.5L or a 3.4L), and run the extra wire from the DME to the solenoid that controls the vacuum to the plenum butterfly like is done on the 3.4 swap. I think this would work fine and save you from dealing with using the 3.2 engine harness, updating to egas and using the 3.2 brain.

I have never done this, but it would be the approach i would take to stick a 3.2 in pre-2.7L boxster.

Todd

I hope you can help.

I am in the process of putting a 3.2L in to my 2.5 97. 2.5 is non egas and the 3.2 is egas. Almost done and in the last phase.

Just a quick question if you could please help.

A specialist advised on using the 2.5 injection system and inlet manifolds on the 3.2 engine but the 2.5 inlet manifold does not fit the 3.2 head.

Can I use the 3.2 inlet manifold? What happens to the pipe that bridges the 3.2 manifold in the back. That pipe has another butterfly in it which is operated by a valve which is on the pipe it self. Because I am using the 2.5 DME and harness and the 2.5 did not have this valve. How is this going to affect the new set-up. Any idea's do I need to plumb this valve up somehow or can I leave it as it is.

Any input would be appreciated.

Br,

Kanin

Edited by tholyoak
tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Pecivil,

I am using supersprint headers, Dansk cats and a supersprint exhaust. I am sorry to hear you are having troubles with Steve's parts, they are what I was wanting to use but he was having problems with his fabricator at the time I needed the parts.

Todd

Todd,

What header/cat/muffler setup did you use for the 3.4?

I bought the setup from Steve Timmons at Instant G and have had major fitament issues with the headers. I may need to go with another setup.

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Both are 12V solenoids, I believe the 4 way function on the timing solenoid is controlled by the duty cycle of the voltage to the valve which causes it to hold position and thus hold the timing at its current stage. The valve lift solenoid is the same as the tiiming, so while it could be controlled on or off, it is also variable viat the duty cycle.

Todd

Hi

I've had my 3.6 waiting in my garage to go in to my 2.5 Boxster which I hope to do over xmas. What sort of signal are you going to provide to the variocam solenoid? I assume its not a straight nothing or 5volts as the solenoid appears to have 4 phase settings...

I believe the cam extra lift 'Plus' part is a straight 5v on to activate it.

Thanks

Marcus

Edited by tholyoak
Kanin Member

Kanin

Posted
Posted

Thanks Todd,

I have gotten to exact same conclusion. Engine is now ready just waiting for new pins for the DME for the wire to the solenoid - they should be in on Monday. Engine is ready and got around the egas exactly as you explain. Using the 3.2 intake but using the 2.5 throttle body. Also had to get a custom adopter for the fuel rail for the return flow on the 3.2 fuel rail. Still using the 2.5 fuel pump - hopefully that will work. If it does not perform as it should I will change the 2.5 fuel pump.

Will let you know on Monday :)

Br,

Kanin

Kanin,

I would not use the 2.5 intake on the 3.2 even if it can be made to fit. Like the 996, I imagine if you use the single cross plenum manifold you will lose significant performance. How are you getting around the egas? Personally if it were me, I would reprogram the brain to the '99 996 program that shares your stock dme, install the 3.2 with a throttle cable throttle body (from your 2.5L or a 3.4L), and run the extra wire from the DME to the solenoid that controls the vacuum to the plenum butterfly like is done on the 3.4 swap. I think this would work fine and save you from dealing with using the 3.2 engine harness, updating to egas and using the 3.2 brain.

I have never done this, but it would be the approach i would take to stick a 3.2 in pre-2.7L boxster.

Todd

I hope you can help.

I am in the process of putting a 3.2L in to my 2.5 97. 2.5 is non egas and the 3.2 is egas. Almost done and in the last phase.

Just a quick question if you could please help.

A specialist advised on using the 2.5 injection system and inlet manifolds on the 3.2 engine but the 2.5 inlet manifold does not fit the 3.2 head.

Can I use the 3.2 inlet manifold? What happens to the pipe that bridges the 3.2 manifold in the back. That pipe has another butterfly in it which is operated by a valve which is on the pipe it self. Because I am using the 2.5 DME and harness and the 2.5 did not have this valve. How is this going to affect the new set-up. Any idea's do I need to plumb this valve up somehow or can I leave it as it is.

Any input would be appreciated.

Br,

Kanin

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You won't need to change the fuel pump, it works fine with the 3.4 and 3.6. If you have the stock 3.2 DME harness I would be interested in purchasing it from you.

Todd

Kanin Member

Kanin

Posted
Posted
You won't need to change the fuel pump, it works fine with the 3.4 and 3.6. If you have the stock 3.2 DME harness I would be interested in purchasing it from you.

Todd

Hi Todd

That should be possible. Lets discuss over e-mail.

By the way what about your 3.4L. If the cost is not high shipping and you are not trying to get rich on the 3.4 I would really be interested in it?

Hard to get these engines over here.

Br,

Kanin

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Kanin,

I am keeping the 3.4 and putting it in a '98 Boxster I just purchased so unfortunately it is not available for sale. I am out of the country right now, but I will email you about the harness when I return.

Todd

You won't need to change the fuel pump, it works fine with the 3.4 and 3.6. If you have the stock 3.2 DME harness I would be interested in purchasing it from you.

Todd

Hi Todd

That should be possible. Lets discuss over e-mail.

By the way what about your 3.4L. If the cost is not high shipping and you are not trying to get rich on the 3.4 I would really be interested in it?

Hard to get these engines over here.

Br,

Kanin

Jinster Member

Jinster

Posted
Posted

These forums are so fantastic. Now I know it's possible to do a 3.2L swap. Almost everyone does the 3.4L so this is great to see there are other options to beef up my 2.5L. Keep up the good work, Kanin.

  • 7 months later...
smartrepair Member

smartrepair

Posted
Posted

Todd

What kind of "piggybag" wiring is needed to get the 3.6 (or 3.8) engine working with 1999 DME? I suppose the main problem is the variocam plus???

I´m not too worried about all the installation being cabable of Porsche PST/WIS diagnosis, but everything should work, except cruise control.

How should the old DME be programmed (I mean the fuel maps)?

or would it be easier to find a newer version of the DME (7.2 I suppose)?

Thanks

Kare

  • 3 months later...
mr2by4 Member

mr2by4

Posted
Posted

Would the ECU 996.618.604.00 be the unit needed to make my 2001 Boxster S run a 3.6 liter variocam car(less the cruise control)?

Would I also need the 996 instrument cluster?

Does that alter the indicated mileage on my car?

What year models of 996 would be appropriate donors?

Could I save myself wiring dilemas by sourcing a dme harness from the 996 or would it also need to be spliced?

Thanks

:renntech:

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Would the ECU 996.618.604.00 be the unit needed to make my 2001 Boxster S run a 3.6 liter variocam car(less the cruise control)?

Yes

Would I also need the 996 instrument cluster?

Yes

Does that alter the indicated mileage on my car?

unless you buy a new one with no miles so that it can be set to the current mileage of your car or you send it out to a speedo shop like PA Speedo so they can set it to the mileage of your car

What year models of 996 would be appropriate donors?

For what? The motor 2002-on.

Could I save myself wiring dilemas by sourcing a dme harness from the 996

No, the 996 harness doesn't fit properly. If you want a harness that needs no modification get a 2002 or later boxster harness

If you love Renntech and find this information useful, perhaps it is time to become a contributing member? ;)

Todd

Edited by tholyoak
mr2by4 Member

mr2by4

Posted
Posted
If you love Renntech and find this information useful, perhaps it is time to become a contributing member? ;)

Todd

Todd,

I tried to do this. My paypal account and my renntech login don't have the same email. It says that I should notify them of this, but I don't see where I notify anyone of this? What is the account to which I make the payment? If I make it manually I can indicate my renntech account id in the notes, there is no such option through their donate link?

I know that this is way off topic for this thread.

Sorry.

:(

mr2by4 Member

mr2by4

Posted
Posted

I sent a message to Loren and hopefully will get this contribution thing resolved.

So I am putting together a parts list to get an idea of my costs.

3.6 motor ($7k-15k)

3.6 ecu ($300-1100)

996 gauge cluster ($300-1300)

sport clutch ($300-2300)

headers and exhaust($900-3500)

motor mounts ($150-300)

spacer ($1-100)

later boxtser engine harness (optional cost$??)

what am I missing?

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You will want to consider a new intake as the Boxster one is undersized for the 3.6, also I would either put a new dual mass flywheel in there or a lightweight one. You may want to replace the front engine mount depending on the mileage on your car. You will need to have the ecu programmed to match the immobilizer in your car.

Todd

mr2by4 Member

mr2by4

Posted
Posted (edited)
You will want to consider a new intake as the Boxster one is undersized for the 3.6, also I would either put a new dual mass flywheel in there or a lightweight one. You may want to replace the front engine mount depending on the mileage on your car. You will need to have the ecu programmed to match the immobilizer in your car.

Todd

Is the ECU reprogram a dealer only deal or will indpendent shops be able to do that?

Does the dealer question this, or do they just care that you have the papers to the car?

Like an evo intake or should it be a custom pipe and cone deal?

Edited by mr2by4
chaudanova Member

chaudanova

Posted
Posted
You will want to consider a new intake as the Boxster one is undersized for the 3.6, also I would either put a new dual mass flywheel in there or a lightweight one. You may want to replace the front engine mount depending on the mileage on your car. You will need to have the ecu programmed to match the immobilizer in your car.

Todd

Todd, when you say new intake, are you referring to the intake manifold, or the intake, as in intake hose/tube & filter?

  • 2 months later...
smartrepair Member

smartrepair

Posted
Posted
While I eventually changed my car to the returnless fuel system, it isn't necessary.

Todd

I have the 3.8 engine with all the fuel rails etc.

And MY99 996. I was wondering (uh, could it be so simple,,???) to install a aftermarket fuel pressure regulator between the 3.8 engine fuel inlet and the fuel line from the fuel pum, and connect the "wastegate" from the pressure regulator to the fuel return line.

Is this possible???

Kare

tholyoak Member

tholyoak

Posted
  • Author
Posted

It is just a fuel supply system. Except for the C4 in the USA, the DME does not regulate fuel pressure.

The factory just went to a returnless system for emissions. Thus, anyway you regulate the fuel pressure, as long as it is the correct pressure will work just fine. You can use the old fuel rail setup and the integrated FPR (just remove the vacuum connection as the later programming doesn't rely on reducing the fuel pressure under vacuum, just a constant 3.8 bar) or you can use the 997 returnless rails and fabricate some sort of aftermarket FPR or you can integrate the returnless system on the car which requires new fuel pump and level sending assembly.

Todd

  • 1 month later...
smartrepair Member

smartrepair

Posted
Posted
It is just a fuel supply system. Except for the C4 in the USA, the DME does not regulate fuel pressure.

The factory just went to a returnless system for emissions. Thus, anyway you regulate the fuel pressure, as long as it is the correct pressure will work just fine. You can use the old fuel rail setup and the integrated FPR (just remove the vacuum connection as the later programming doesn't rely on reducing the fuel pressure under vacuum, just a constant 3.8 bar) or you can use the 997 returnless rails and fabricate some sort of aftermarket FPR or you can integrate the returnless system on the car which requires new fuel pump and level sending assembly.

Todd

What was your solution for the 7.8 DME wiring harness connectors, as they are different than the earlier one. Can I buy them separately (Audi, Volkswagenparts perhaps?)?

kare

  • 2 weeks later...
ouroboros Member

ouroboros

Posted
Posted

Hi Todd,

First post - I love my 2004 986 500 SE but it's time for more power now it's only used on the track. Great thread (amazed you make it sound so easy! ) and I'm therefore putting together the following shipping list:

- 3.6 motor

- ECU reprogram (Softronic?)

- Air intake upstream of the throttle bod

- 996 gauge cluster

Any other misc parts I need, like headers, spacers,etc. I'm presuming my wiring from my MY is okay?

Also for the 20,000 dollar question, where do you get your engines from ? :lol:

Cheers,

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